Is there a reason NOT to fire

JAFO

Member
Oct 3, 2010
33
1
8
Iowa
I agree that QB Sam R. should not be running the ball so much. I would also like to see 5 or 6 designed runs a game. However, if the play is a zone read, the defense can force QB Sam R. to keep the ball and run. See UNI game. To reduce the number of running plays with our QB requires a sharp reduction in zone read plays. Wouldn't it?
 

stateofmind

Well-Known Member
Jul 16, 2007
6,635
4,174
113
Ankeny
I agree that there is history to base the evaluations on, but I'd like to see what happens on the 14th before I go for heads.
-What I'm confused about is where was the dual TE set that we heard about all pre-season? Brun and Bibbs barely played, and when they did they weren't getting to the first down stick. Are they in trouble? Do they not understand the playbook? We know Brun has the ability, so I'm guessing it's the coaching.
-Did we think that we could utilize the WRs more and were assuming that we could handle the aggressive second half UNI D?

I guess I would've thought one big adjustment would've been to move back to the 1-2 offensive set with two TEs to help with blocking when SR couldn't find time and the tackles didn't appear to be doing their job. If nothing else, one of the two TEs should've been a big target. If they aren't ready, then that is on Bleil.

Was the game-plan vanilla because of the youth? I'm really confused on what is being done to prepare this team.
 

Cyclophile1

Well-Known Member
Dec 14, 2009
1,910
120
48
Overland Park, KS
I posted this in another thread but this is the SIXTH time ISU has failed to score a touchdown in the second half with Messingham as the OC. Out of 14 games. Think about that...we sure aren't making adjustments to the defense. Or we are terrible at them.

That is a ridiculous stat and utterly DAMNING. It speaks for itself.
 

clonedude

Well-Known Member
Apr 16, 2006
33,050
29,304
113
I also do not understand how you don't make an adjustment of some kind on the zone read. It was obvious to everyone that UNI was crashing everyone on our RB every time and forcing Sam to take it himself. Why wouldn't you do that? I'd much rather have Sam running it against me than James White or Aaron Wimberly. Not only is Sam not a RB, but he's your starting QB, so there's a chance you can knock him out of the game too, which UNI nearly did.

And I'm one of those that's also in the camp of why we don't send a WR or TE right over the middle on a quick slant if the LB is blitzing? That should be an automatic hot read between the QB and the receiver. We NEVER do it.
 

megamanxzero35

Well-Known Member
May 31, 2011
2,528
725
113
I agree that there is history to base the evaluations on, but I'd like to see what happens on the 14th before I go for heads.
-What I'm confused about is where was the dual TE set that we heard about all pre-season? Brun and Bibbs barely played, and when they did they weren't getting to the first down stick. Are they in trouble? Do they not understand the playbook? We know Brun has the ability, so I'm guessing it's the coaching.
-Did we think that we could utilize the WRs more and were assuming that we could handle the aggressive second half UNI D?

I guess I would've thought one big adjustment would've been to move back to the 1-2 offensive set with two TEs to help with blocking when SR couldn't find time and the tackles didn't appear to be doing their job. If nothing else, one of the two TEs should've been a big target. If they aren't ready, then that is on Bleil.

Was the game-plan vanilla because of the youth? I'm really confused on what is being done to prepare this team.

I can only comment on the 2nd half with no Brun, but he cramped up and didn't play in the 2nd half. Maybe coaches don't like or feel comfortable with a Boeson/Bibbs duel TE set yet. Maybe they want Brun and someone else out there for those.
 

CYUL8R

Well-Known Member
Feb 13, 2012
1,320
78
63
How about this for an idea? Have all the offensive coaches play a season of NCAA football using ISU and whoever comes out national champ becomes our new OC. Wally can be the other player to keep defense consistent.

Seems logical compared to what it is now.
 

isugcs

Well-Known Member
SuperFanatic
SuperFanatic T2
Feb 21, 2007
1,669
59
48
Waverly
Reason: Oline did not cut it last night, poor rushing stats, lots of sacks. Farniok going out is the root cause. Fundamental FB concept: Without good oline play your offense is severely limited (you can't play call yourself out of that).

Klenakis better earn his paycheck the next two weeks. Fix this issue and you'll see RB's do better and Sam become even more productive.

Upon watching the game again this evening, really the center and guards played pretty well. What really effected our passing game was the tackle play, very poor. The good news, this is correctable. I think we will see improvement with this team. When you consider this and knowing the other major issue was tackling I really believe this team will improve. We may be surprised how this team turns out.
 

GWad

Member
Aug 22, 2013
807
6
18
Play calling is not the problem, talent is. That's not focused just on Mess....
 

GWad

Member
Aug 22, 2013
807
6
18
.............And I'm one of those that's also in the camp of why we don't send a WR or TE right over the middle on a quick slant if the LB is blitzing? That should be an automatic hot read between the QB and the receiver. We NEVER do it.
THIS!!!!!!!!
 

cycloneworld

Facebook Knows All
SuperFanatic
SuperFanatic T2
Mar 20, 2006
30,179
22,529
113
Urbandale, IA
Play calling is not the problem, talent is. That's not focused just on Mess....

Completely disagree. We certainly have enough talent to put up points in the first half. And then the other team catches on, makes adjustments, and for whatever reason we never recover in the second half. I highly doubt our guys lose their talent in the second halves. That's coaching and play calling.
 

Luth4Cy

Well-Known Member
Sep 19, 2012
5,520
134
63
Ames, IA
Play calling is not the problem, talent is. That's not focused just on Mess....

No, talent is less of an issue now on the offensive side of the ball then it's been in a long time. Even if talent was the problem, we are still more talented then the likes of UNI. With the talent we have, it comes back to purely coaching and play calling, in this case play calling.
 

cyatheart

Well-Known Member
SuperFanatic
SuperFanatic T2
Nov 18, 2008
9,467
6,976
113
49
I said before, I think handing Mess the job was a huge mistake. I say that in retrospect, where it is easy to say. You cann't fire him now, it is too late, if a change was going to take place it needed to be done last year. I think reasonable peopel can disagree on how to fix it. My guess is, like most things, it is a combination of things. Poor blocking, QB holdinng the ball too long, receivers not getting open, and poor play calling and gameplanning.

However, it is clear, and no fair minded person can disagree at this point, ISU is NOT sccoring enough points on offense. This is irrefutable. Scoring 20 points is NOT enough in this conference. Not even close. No person can sit here and say the offenses performance has been acceptabe in the last year. An offense with a pulse gets us wins vs WV, K State and Texas Tech forr sure last year and UNI this year. That is 4 wins in a little over a year. It needs to be fixed and it needs too be fixed, or at least improved, yesterday.


I don't know what to do, but we have people making a ton of money, that sure as hell need to figure it out, and figure it out fast. We wasted a season of two NFL linebackers on defense because we can't figure out how to score more than 20 points.
 

SenorCy

Well-Known Member
Aug 29, 2010
1,560
124
63
C.J.
Play calling is not the problem, talent is. That's not focused just on Mess....
3580.yao_5F00_ming_5F00_meme_5F00_new_5F00_version_5F00_hd_5F00_by_5F00_guillersevilla_2D00_d3dwein1.png
 

ISU_Alum_2000

All-Star
Oct 21, 2006
1,956
102
63
Aliso Viejo, CA
I posted this in another thread but this is the SIXTH time ISU has failed to score a touchdown in the second half with Messingham as the OC. Out of 14 games. Think about that...we sure aren't making adjustments to the defense. Or we are terrible at them.

Is that real? If that's true, that's completely inept.
 

cycloneworld

Facebook Knows All
SuperFanatic
SuperFanatic T2
Mar 20, 2006
30,179
22,529
113
Urbandale, IA
Is that real? If that's true, that's completely inept.

I looked at half by half scoring in this post:
http://www.cyclonefanatic.com/forum/football/175187-there-reason-not-fire-5.html#post3574726

Digging a little more, not only have we not scored a 2nd half TD in 6 of 14 games, we've never scored more than 2 touchdowns in the second half (TCU was the only game we scored more than 16 and one of the TDs was a defensive touchdown).

That's scary. Especially in an offensive-loaded conference.
 

Tre4ISU

Well-Known Member
SuperFanatic
SuperFanatic T2
Dec 30, 2008
28,211
9,323
113
Estherville
I looked at half by half scoring in this post:
http://www.cyclonefanatic.com/forum/football/175187-there-reason-not-fire-5.html#post3574726

Digging a little more, not only have we not scored a 2nd half TD in 6 of 14 games, we've never scored more than 2 touchdowns in the second half (TCU was the only game we scored more than 16 and one of the TDs was a defensive touchdown).

That's scary. Especially in an offensive-loaded conference.

If you really want to be disappointed look at how many games we have been completely in the past couple years at halftime. Then Wally locks down and we can't score enough to win. The offense has held this team back from winning games they had great chances to win.
 

weR138

Well-Known Member
Feb 20, 2008
12,187
5,138
113
I looked at half by half scoring in this post:
http://www.cyclonefanatic.com/forum/football/175187-there-reason-not-fire-5.html#post3574726

Digging a little more, not only have we not scored a 2nd half TD in 6 of 14 games, we've never scored more than 2 touchdowns in the second half (TCU was the only game we scored more than 16 and one of the TDs was a defensive touchdown).

That's scary. Especially in an offensive-loaded conference.

cw, you should seriously start a thread about this.
 
  • Like
Reactions: cycloneworld

Aclone

Well-Known Member
Dec 14, 2007
26,960
23,584
113
Des Moines, Ia.
If there has ever been a game that told you 100% talent was not the problem, it was last Saturday. How could you possibly think otherwise?
Did you actually watch the game? "Talent" doesn't include solely the skill positions. Better pass protection, better offensive tackles, and we win that game.

Edit: I have to admit that I had high hopes for Lichtenberg and Gannon finally playing tackle. That dudn't seem to work out real well so far, however.
 
Last edited:

Help Support Us

Become a patron