LMAO

[Drew0311]

Worse than Kansas States?

Yes it was bad. Both were pretty bad. I remember walking into the Olson building and thinking I was in the wrong locker rooms because they were so bad.

 

[Drew0311]

Nice to see another Johnnie here - have been my entire life. FYI - John is still the winningest coach in college football history (at least by number of wins) and will never be touched. Good man and Great coach who I knew personally. While he cared for his players immensely, he also knew the bottom line was winning (and did it more than any other coach in history). Amazing ability to break down film and identify minute flaws in other teams.

I took Theory of Football and Sports Medicine taught by John (although SM was mainly about getting dates for the guys in the class with the women in the course ).

Was he the coach that was against wearing pads during practice so his players would not get hurt as much and would have all of them available for the game? I always thought that was a brilliant strategy. Why risk getting your best players hurt in practice.

 

[isufanz1]

Was he the coach that was against wearing pads during practice so his players would not get hurt as much and would have all of them available for the game? I always thought that was a brilliant strategy. Why risk getting your best players hurt in practice.

Yes he was - along with a lot of other 'different' approaches to football. One of the most unusal was not having a 'formal' Strength and Training program/requirement. While not specifically required, it was done and led entirely by the player/leaders of the program. His program in many ways was the original player led program.

I can still remember watching my cousin play for the 1976 team which won the National Title that year (he was the starting flanker).

Truly the most magnificent place to watch a college football game in the US. I wish everyone had the chance to do it once.

 

[Gunnerclone]

Dedicated ST coach. New O-line coach. Start there for changes. Don’t blow it all up Paul Rhoads style because that is a path to disaster. Need a 2-3 year plan.

 

[CloniesForLife]

Yes he was - along with a lot of other 'different' approaches to football. One of the most unusal was not having a 'formal' Strength and Training program/requirement. While not specifically required, it was done and led entirely by the player/leaders of the program. His program in many ways was the original player led program.

I can still remember watching my cousin play for the 1976 team which won the National Title that year (he was the starting flanker).

Truly the most magnificent place to watch a college football game in the US. I wish everyone had the chance to do it once.

Johnnie Tommie games at that stadium were so fun. Such a bummer that isn't a rivalry anymore. What was the stretch the team did before the game where they just laid down and stared at the sky?

 

[Cloned4Life]

Just a couple notes on these accomplishments. A 9 win season is a little different today as we play a 12 game season when it used to be 11. And of course with bowl wins, it is so much easier to get to a bowl game now so wins are easier to get as well .

I am not even close to being on the fire CMC train, but you do need to have perspective when we say we can't do better than him because of how he compares to our history. The modern landscape of college football is a much different deal than even 20 years ago. And for much of ISUs history we made basically no effort to even try to be decent at football. At times I would say our admin actively worked against it. The situation with ISU football today is far different than it ever has been, and thus so is the potential.

The Big 12 has clearly been down the last half a decade or more also. Texas is as mediocre as EVER, and basically the entire conference is beating them, both home and away, including Kansas. OU had also been as beatable in conference as ever during CMC’s tenure. And when they’ve gotten to the CFP, they get absolutely slaughtered.
So while it’s cool CMC has shown that Iowa State football SHOULD expect to be competitive against the rest of the league, he most certainly has not had the crazy “omg we’ve arrived” season, and yeah that includes Covid 2020. That year, he blew the first game of the season, and was severely out-coached in our first ever appearance on the CCG. Hell even Kansas had a magical 10+ win season in the last 20 years, yet we STILL cannot do it.

The conference as a whole is certainly tough and competitive from 1 - 10, but we’re no longer severely out-talent’d across the board. When we’ve lost games in the past 4 seasons, the reason for those losses is coaching. The reason we lose close games is coaching.

TCU was bad last year, now they are great. They’ve taken advantage of their opportunities and have delivered time and time again.

In 2017, we started bad, got to 6-2, and we all couldn’t believe it. Wow! Our time! We did it! 2 year turnaround! Everyone else does it, including Kansas, why not us! The team had offensive talent, and was playing really well and together on defense. We proceed to choke down the stretch, losing 3 out of 4 and ending up in Memphis, getting - you guessed it - outcoached in those losses.

The same negative trends that have led to losses through his entire tenure - literally ALL stemming from lack of discipline in all areas and lack of “winning in the margins” - still exist! Still! Each game!

I don’t know how fans are supposed to “hope” that all of a sudden these trends change. They are the core of this entire staff. Nothing is more consistent with Iowa State football than “losing in the margins”. I don’t get why our fans have to be “OK” with this because “we’re not getting blown out like we used to”.

 

[isufanz1]

Johnnie Tommie games at that stadium were so fun. Such a bummer that isn't a rivalry anymore. What was the stretch the team did before the game where they just laid down and stared at the sky?

If I remember correctly it was called the "The Beautiful Day" stretch. Done every pregame.

Johnnie/Tommie games were a sight to behold and something I truly miss. Have been to numerous J/T contests in my life with the good guys winning way more than our share. Just not the same since the STU move to DI.

 

[CycloneErik]

I have heard for years that CMC is absolutely fine with close games, so he won't allow the offense to be explosive. And now I believe CMC is absolutely fine with LOSING close games, so he won't change the OC or OL coaches or allow the OC to build and explosive offence. I am somewhat glad there is only one game left this year till we see if JP is happy with the product we are getting.

He's fine with them, but he's not good at them.

 

[LtRaczack]

I'm a Bruce fan all the way, just answered a question about "some" things MC did that Bruce didn't. As for the number of Bowl Games, that is not as relevant as what happened once in the Bowl Games. I didn't mention going to more Bowl Games because of the current Bowl proliferation.

However, MC did win two Bowl Games against the Pac-12 Champion in 2020 and the AAC Divisional Champion on their home field in 2017. Just those two games alone were better than the two Bowl losses Bruce had including the 1978 Hall of Fame Bowl @ Legion Field vs. Texas A&M (7-4) that was my first Cyclone Game to see in person!

P.S. Good call on Danny Mac's 2000 team! Loved that team and season. However, they had some fluff OOC wins, didn't have the best record in the Big Xii and didn't finish in the top 10 with a Major Bowl win over the Pac-12 Champion like the 2020 team did.

I am looking at the body of work over a few seasons. I agree when it comes to individual accomplishments the 2020 team definitely achieved the most. However, I think the argument can be made that the very best team Iowa State ever had was the 1976 team. I know at the end of the day it is truly comparing apples to oranges. College football is very different from the 1970s to the 2000s and 2010s-2020s. Except of course for Oklahoma who ran their version of NIL in the Switzer era ).

I think Earle Bruce should always be recognized for building the most consistency across multiple seasons. There has been no Iowa State coach who has ever achieved three consecutive 8-win seasons in a row. Matt had a chance in 2019 but that season included a bizarre stretch of winnable games being lost (Iowa, OSU, KSU). Imagine 2019 if it ended with winning just one or two of those three games and suddenly it is 9-4 even with the bowl loss. I'd like to think if there was more consistency, you'd have seen an 8-9 win season before or after the 2020 season at least.

I really wish we could have seen an alternate history where Earle Bruce stays at Iowa State through the 1980s and John Cooper follows him in the 1990s compelling the state and university to support Iowa State as the state's primary football team. Think of Elwood Drive being renamed to Bruce Boulevard and Cyclone Stadium being renamed to Jack Trice in the mid 1980s with a vast expansion of capacity. Hayden Fry really struggled with Donnie Duncan teams that consisted of what was left of the foundation Bruce built. Donnie never coached again after his stint at Iowa State. We all know the reality is Criner was brought in to be crushed by Fry.

 

[cayin]

One year, Danny Mac had a 9-3 season too. We really get a lot of mileage out of a year where quite a few people were saying it was too dangerous to even snap the ball in the field.

Earle Bruce achieved three 8 win seasons in a row. Matt has not achieved that and blew that chance in 2019 despite having more games and more chances to reach 8 wins before the pandemic season was even in the mix.

There were only 15 bowl games during Bruce’s tenure.

Finally, since so many care more about the coach than Iowa State the football program. Earle Bruce was hired at Ohio State and came within one point of an undefeated National Championship team with the same players legendary Woody Hayes gave a 7-4-1 season the year before. How many think any power five program with a pulse is knocking down Campbell’s door now?

Earle Bruce did more with less and achieved more objectively. Matt keeps up his current streak and his winning percentage (which only matters when we say it does) will be below Bruce’s.

Plus Bruce didn’t have a lot of his starters for those bowl games

 

[cayin]

Yes he was - along with a lot of other 'different' approaches to football. One of the most unusal was not having a 'formal' Strength and Training program/requirement. While not specifically required, it was done and led entirely by the player/leaders of the program. His program in many ways was the original player led program.

I can still remember watching my cousin play for the 1976 team which won the National Title that year (he was the starting flanker).

Truly the most magnificent place to watch a college football game in the US. I wish everyone had the chance to do it once.

The setting at St John’s is truly amazing

 

[jctisu]

One year, Danny Mac had a 9-3 season too. We really get a lot of mileage out of a year where quite a few people were saying it was too dangerous to even snap the ball in the field.

Earle Bruce achieved three 8 win seasons in a row. Matt has not achieved that and blew that chance in 2019 despite having more games and more chances to reach 8 wins before the pandemic season was even in the mix.

There were only 15 bowl games during Bruce’s tenure.

Finally, since so many care more about the coach than Iowa State the football program. Earle Bruce was hired at Ohio State and came within one point of an undefeated National Championship team with the same players legendary Woody Hayes gave a 7-4-1 season the year before. How many think any power five program with a pulse is knocking down Campbell’s door now?

Earle Bruce did more with less and achieved more objectively. Matt keeps up his current streak and his winning percentage (which only matters when we say it does) will be below Bruce’s.

Cool and Bruce is long gone and can't coach us. So what's the ******* point? Post Bruce we sucked ass forever aside from a couple of years under McCarney. So even if CMC is a notch below Bruce in your eyes, he's far and away #2 in our history. What happened after we lost our only other good coach (Bruce)? We sucked for a LOOOOONNNGGGG time.

If JP ever pulls the trigger and fires CMC, he better have a damn good candidate waiting on deck that is as sure fire as can be. Because we could easily turn into Nebraska if we aren't careful. CMC has a long leash, and has earned it. If this type of season happens next year, then let's revisit things. But the guy has easily bought himself several years barring a bunch of 0 to 2 win seasons and getting blown off the field.

 

[jctisu]

Dedicated ST coach. New O-line coach. Start there for changes. Don’t blow it all up Paul Rhoads style because that is a path to disaster. Need a 2-3 year plan.

100% this. Especially the O-line. I think people would be floored at what our offense would look like if we had a good O-line. Manning still is a complete dunce, but when you watch other teams on Saturday's almost no other P5 team's O-line looks as pathetic as ours.

 

[LtRaczack]

Cool and Bruce is long gone and can't coach us. So what's the ******* point? Post Bruce we sucked ass forever aside from a couple of years under McCarney. So even if CMC is a notch below Bruce in your eyes, he's far and away #2 in our history. What happened after we lost our only other good coach (Bruce)? We sucked for a LOOOOONNNGGGG time.

If JP ever pulls the trigger and fires CMC, he better have a damn good candidate waiting on deck that is as sure fire as can be. Because we could easily turn into Nebraska if we aren't careful. CMC has a long leash, and has earned it. If this type of season happens next year, then let's revisit things. But the guy has easily bought himself several years barring a bunch of 0 to 2 win seasons and getting blown off the field.

Alright, you just said a bunch of 0-2 win seasons so it looks like even that performance changes nothing.

Honestly I think Matt is a genius from this perspective. He has a very well paying job and has absolutely no performance expectations. Only has to deal with 12-13 games (only 12 without a bowl) and press conferences making vague comments.

 

[jctisu]

Alright, you just said a bunch of 0-2 win seasons so it looks like even that performance changes nothing.

Honestly I think Matt is a genius from this perspective. He has a very well paying job and has absolutely no performance expectations. Only has to deal with 12-13 games (only 12 without a bowl) and press conferences making vague comments.

At this EXACT juncture yes several 0 to 2 win seasons. Now if this season we have going on repeats itself next year, that leash on those 0 to 2 win seasons gets even shorter. Comprehend how coaching works at a school with our resources? I mean blindly just firing coaches has worked oh so well for (checks notes) Nebraska, Texas, Auburn, etc.

If recruiting starts to go south and there is clearly no direction up then you make that change. It's not even possible to be having that conversation when this is the only year of completely sub-par football. Last year was bad because we should have been better. But still managed a winning record, so it's not a colossal failure. Just a failure with what we had returning.

But again, throw out someone you want as head coach. Go on, we are listening. And try to keep in mind A) The real chance of actually getting said coach to come to Ames AND B) Holding onto that coach more than a minute should he find any success. Because fun fact, most anyone else here that sniffs success is bolting immediately when a bigger schools comes calling. Matt hasn't done that to us, and he's definitely had the chance. So he gets more leash from me by sticking it out with us when he absolutely didn't have to the last couple of years with the offers he turned down.

 

[LtRaczack]

At this EXACT juncture yes several 0 to 2 win seasons. Now if this season we have going on repeats itself next year, that leash on those 0 to 2 win seasons gets even shorter. Comprehend how coaching works at a school with our resources? I mean blindly just firing coaches has worked oh so well for (checks notes) Nebraska, Texas, Auburn, etc.

If recruiting starts to go south and there is clearly no direction up then you make that change. It's not even possible to be having that conversation when this is the only year of completely sub-par football. Last year was bad because we should have been better. But still managed a winning record, so it's not a colossal failure. Just a failure with what we had returning.

But again, throw out someone you want as head coach. Go on, we are listening. And try to keep in mind A) The real chance of actually getting said coach to come to Ames AND B) Holding onto that coach more than a minute should he find any success. Because fun fact, most anyone else here that sniffs success is bolting immediately when a bigger schools comes calling. Matt hasn't done that to us, and he's definitely had the chance. So he gets more leash from me by sticking it out with us when he absolutely didn't have to the last couple of years with the offers he turned down.

You are absolutely right.

 

[jctisu]

You are absolutely right.

I know I am.

 

[iastatefan1]

If you can't handle CMC at his Tom Manning you don't deserve him at his John Heacock. jimlad

 

[CyCrazy]

If you can't handle CMC at his Tom Manning you don't deserve him at his John Heacock. jimlad

Wut

 

[CyNews]

Plus Bruce didn’t have a lot of his starters for those bowl games

Coach Bruce was a disciplinarian with a very good staff. People criticized his three yards and a cloud of dust, but he had playmakers (Blue, Hardeman, Stanley, Rubley, etc.,etc, and rock-jawed linemen,many homegrown). Also,a good kicking game. It was great to watch him coach.