OSU postgame overreaction thread
- Thread starter baller1
- Start date
Iowa State has played with fire against inferior (and in some cases just plain bad) teams pretty much all season long. Not really surprising it’s come back to haunt them multiple times this year. Looking back at the Dayton game, the second Colorado game, or even the Arizona State game where it took Jones going unconscious to pull it out; Maybe the warning signs were there all along and I just chose to ignore them.
WVU, K-State, and OK State are all just flat out bad losses that are unacceptable for a top 10 team. I don’t know if it’s a talent issue or what.
WVU, K-State, and OK State are all just flat out bad losses that are unacceptable for a top 10 team. I don’t know if it’s a talent issue or what.
Are Sweet 16 season’s bad now? Are we going to equate what was accomplished in TJ’s first year and being an #11 seed to finishing as a #2 seed last year and winning the Big 12 conference tournament and finishing second in the regular season. I guess I’m just shocked at how intellectually dishonest many Cyclone fans are at this point.
Last night wasn’t great. But I’m not burying this team yet. Let’s get a win Saturday as the calendar turns to March, get healthy and get on a heater.
It seems like it would be hard to play a season of college basketball with a broken right thumb. Even harder when one or both of the guys that can help with that job are out.
I hope Tamin and Hall of Famer Allison Lacey never read game day threads.
I hope Tamin and Hall of Famer Allison Lacey never read game day threads.
Things that feel true but I could be making up:
1. There’s a **** ton more parity in college basketball now than a decade+ ago, and it makes breaking the top ten easier with great-not-elite teams. The expectation of what it means to be “top ten” has changed.
2. Felt all season we don’t pass the eye test of an elite team, even when the metrics disagreed. We’re a good team, often great, that’s had good breaks over a small sample size. But from the start, the three line has been wide open for opponents all season, and for awhile teams kept bricking it regardless. Bad ball movement, too much hero ball and wild turnovers, Lipsey clearly injured, etc.
3. Otz’s teams haven’t had the depth to roll with injuries/sickness and get worn out by March. The defensive intensity in practice and conference season is a killer and we keep hitting this moment. It’s going to keep happening until we can afford a bigger rotation or we ease up at practice.
4. We could easily get bounced the first game, but no one should be surprised if we still reach the final four, even if we drop a few more stinkers. We’re right in the mix!
1. There’s a **** ton more parity in college basketball now than a decade+ ago, and it makes breaking the top ten easier with great-not-elite teams. The expectation of what it means to be “top ten” has changed.
2. Felt all season we don’t pass the eye test of an elite team, even when the metrics disagreed. We’re a good team, often great, that’s had good breaks over a small sample size. But from the start, the three line has been wide open for opponents all season, and for awhile teams kept bricking it regardless. Bad ball movement, too much hero ball and wild turnovers, Lipsey clearly injured, etc.
3. Otz’s teams haven’t had the depth to roll with injuries/sickness and get worn out by March. The defensive intensity in practice and conference season is a killer and we keep hitting this moment. It’s going to keep happening until we can afford a bigger rotation or we ease up at practice.
4. We could easily get bounced the first game, but no one should be surprised if we still reach the final four, even if we drop a few more stinkers. We’re right in the mix!
What a frustrating game to watch. No sense of urgency especially out of our leaders. When down 10 with about 3 minutes left we know we are going to need possessions so maybe at least jog the ball up the court? Nope, let's use a full 9 seconds getting the ball up without a single defender even on that end of the court.
This isn't a health issue that can just be excused away. Yes Milan, CJ, and KG being out reduces the ceiling and margin on off nights. But that I think is not the root cause here.
The offense has got stagnant / defendable / turnover prone for about a month now. IDK if they are scouted, trying new things that aren't working yet, or just flat out tired. At times they look overconfident and sloppy. Maybe it's just the bigs having bad nights makes the perimeter super guardable.
But whatever is going on, it needs fixed asap. This team needs to be scoring ~80 to win games.
They have only won 2 games scoring less than 75 (74 vs BU & KU) and every loss they have scored <70 points (except OT @AZ and Auburn). There's your Mendoza line for this team.
Other notes-
averaging 7.5 less 2PA per game since ASU
averaging 4 more TO per game since ASU
The offense has got stagnant / defendable / turnover prone for about a month now. IDK if they are scouted, trying new things that aren't working yet, or just flat out tired. At times they look overconfident and sloppy. Maybe it's just the bigs having bad nights makes the perimeter super guardable.
But whatever is going on, it needs fixed asap. This team needs to be scoring ~80 to win games.
They have only won 2 games scoring less than 75 (74 vs BU & KU) and every loss they have scored <70 points (except OT @AZ and Auburn). There's your Mendoza line for this team.
Other notes-
averaging 7.5 less 2PA per game since ASU
averaging 4 more TO per game since ASU
It feels a bit like we’re just trying to stumble into March.
The length of the season and no nights off does not seem to be something the new guys are acclimated to.
The length of the season and no nights off does not seem to be something the new guys are acclimated to.
the only reason we lost this game is because we didn't take care of the ball...plain and simple
And in contrast they treat other possessions with plenty of time left like it's a fire drill.
This has happened in comfortable wins against good teams and bad teams and in about each loss.
I get what you're saying but it also makes no sense.....all of the transfers know that the season is long....each D1 team plays 31 regular season games, regardless of conference...sure, the Big 12 is a bump up in competition and you're bound to get more worn down as the season goes along, but that's not just an Iowa State thing....every major conference team deals with injuries and fatigue.
I also just want to vent about how atrocious the stats/graphics were last night. Adding fouls to ISU when it was on OSU, the possession arrow being handled completely backwards.
It was nearly useless to have on screen at times.
It was nearly useless to have on screen at times.
I have a feeling Jizzle James might transfer and it would be awesome to get him, but if he decides to transfer, some school with an endless amount of money will get him....
There was a stretch ~7-4 mins left last night that more than a few players picked up their urgency.
I don’t normally like addressing effort, particularly because the eye test rewards less talented players, but it seems like we have spells where we’re going through the motions.
hasn't that always technically been the case for at least the power conferences? Iowa State knows most years what their seed line already is, yet our fans go down in droves anyway.....partly because KC is a great city as a host and it's just a fun time bouncing between the P&L and the Sprint Center (it will always be the Sprint Center in my eyes)
I'm not trying to pick on you, but I've heard this a few times and don't get it.
Why would we play better against NCAA tournament teams than we did against sub-.500 Oklahoma State?
I suppose you could say getting Gilbert back at 100% (if that happens), but let's face it- this team has serious issues with our without him.
Since this is the doom thread, I'll play along. The more likely scenario, if we're in a tailspin to end the season, isn't that we suddenly turn it on and become a better team in the NCAAs. It is that we continue to play the way we've been playing, and have an early exit.
Because every game and week is different and things can change in an instant.
10 years ago ISU willed themselves to win the Big 12 tourney and looked the part of a team about to put it together for a run.
Then the NCAA tournament first round happened.
Despite my doomerism, I will say this is the one thing that gives me an ounce of hope. It's still unlikely to me this team lays an egg first round. second round, who knows. But if you survive that, maybe, just maybe, you get a favorable matchup for once. There are even some probable 2 seeds that don't worry me much. But avoiding a letdown the first two games is what I have no certainty in after yesterday
lol it pained me to single out anyone from the early Otz years, given how much they overperformed relative to overall talent. But I had to make the point that ultimately results are what people remember. ISU fans may take into account that a certain team accomplished x against all odds, or that another team had potential but got a bad draw. But eventually these things blend into a stat sheet with bullet points, regardless of circumstances. That is how the majority—who are not ISU fans—judge. Recruits don't necessarily follow these things at a granular level. God knows the national perception of Iowa State is that they're cute, have had some recent success in major sports, but will never get over the hump or rise to the occasion when the lights are brightest
See my response above regarding results. Sweet Sixteens are great. It's also reasonable to have high expectations for this team. Both things can be true. Matt Campbell didn't just want to outperform the program's dismal historical record, he wanted players, coaches, and fans to hold a P4 program to a higher standard. Otz has raised the standard, and I've had high expectations for this team all season, so it's the opposite of intellectual dishonesty. Of course last year's team was better than '21-'22. I'm not sure what that proves, however. We can quibble all day about accomplishment rankings, giving teams their due, or declaring this or that team underperformers. But an ACC fan simply reads "2 Sweet Sixteens" in a CBS article or what have you, they don't care what the rosters were, or who a team beat in January. I'm over the moon with what Otz has done. I also want this team to advance further
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Agreed, I also think the regular season becomes a slog for some teams, almost get bored, then they get rejuvenated once the postseason hits. I think Iowa State with their experience and balanced roster has as good a shot as any to make a Final 4 run.
The one thing this year is that the top teams are really really good this year so it's going to be tougher to make a run than past years. Auburn, Alabama, Tennessee, Florida, Houston and Duke are all very good to great teams, rare that you see College Basketball with so many elite teams but these 6 are really good, I don't remember the last time there was 6 teams this good at the top. Usually there's a lot of turmoil at the top, not this year. Still, and maybe it's a bit of a homer thing, but I like Iowa State's chances against anybody on a netural floor. Gilbert HAS TO get healthy though, he's their engine.
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