Agree with this. The traditional 5 is rare nowadays but I don't think you'd put Ward on an island against like, Lampkin at TCU.
RECRUITING: Jeremiah Williams and Hason Ward to visit this weekend
- Thread starter JStanz51
- Start date
Our defense isn't putting anyone on an island - it's predicated on running help at anyone who dares bring the ball into the lane
I think what this signifies to me is that TJ isn't as concerned/focused on offensive upgrades this offseason as many of us would like - but that he's continuing to focus on defense and attitude when bringing in parts
This would be an enormous mistake and should worry every single fan if the staff doesn't think it was a problem that should be addressed. Especially after losing Brockington. The defense was top 5? in adjusted efficiency already and didn't finish top half in the conference. I would imagine that's a realistic goal we'd all like to see the team achieve in year 2.
I would be stunned if they take Williams/Ward and don't fill the other spot(s) with a difference maker on offense. Easier said than done, but I have to believe there's a plan in place beyond like just hoping it works out after losing your best offensive player (by a wide margin) from a team with a bad offense.
Seems like an ok get at the 5. Athletic and long that could help on defense and can dunk some lobs from Hunter. Seems like a likely bench guy and if so then that is a good bench get.
Absolutely. Ideally they can find someone in the frontcourt that can do more offensively to start but Ward off the bench would be great.
The thought cyclonehomer was responding to was he would be able to take traditional posts without a double. I don't know if that's true, even with our defense- there is also a difference between running help to cause havoc, and not being able to defend well without it.
Ward is in theory a competent Big 12 post defender as an experienced player with his length, but I think you're saying his real defensive value is in our system. He is the ideal help man. He is very mobile and can cover a lot of ground. He can help the 4 and recover. He can drop off his man and challenge someone driving to the rim. He can defend ball screens. He can run. In terms of defense, if you have 2-3 of these types on the floor, the court becomes very small for the offense. Judging by adding Jeremiah Williams and interest in Eric Williams/Dennis, plus Tre King and Watson, we're making the court small on that end. It will be fun to watch.
I think it shows TJ wants to maintain, if not slightly improve the defense. It wasn't just the quickest path to rebuilding.
Could it also mean they feel good about AJ? To be elite on defense you need a roster that is good on defense. To improve on last year's offense, we likely need just one more piece. Two with IB gone. Hunter improving could be one. AJ another. Basile would be a third, and pair well with Ward. Incrementally, Williams, King, and Watson all give us things we did not have a year ago on offense, even if not likely to be step-change guys individually.
With as many fouls as Conditt and Jones racked up last season, having another competent defender down low is crucial to how this team plays defense. Yes, he may be a minimal upgrade compared to Conditt/Jones but he would be a solid role player who would let this defense continue playing how they want to.
We haven't had an athletic 5 like Ward since McKay (well, maybe Lard). He would be a nice upgrade to the 5 position.
I would not mind Ward if we got another scoring center or a stretch 4. Still think we are going to be very challenged on offense at this rate. Probably even worse losing Brockington.
I was just going to bump the discussion about whether TJ would prefer the McKay over others.
Give me a McKay (or a Lard) on all Cyclone teams. if Ward is similar on defense, rebounding, and transition, you can see why we only had one of Jones and Conditt return.
I think both McKay and Lard were more offensively talented then we thought contemporary speaking, since they were in the era in which we played guys like Georges, Ejim, White, Burton, Nader etc in the frontcourt, so if Ward is like that, we're getting a lot better.
Like McKay playing next to Georges, I think Ward would be very complementary next to a guy like Basile or even Kunc. I don't have a good feel for King's game.
I think it's critical for a legit contending roster to have at least one, if not more than one dudes just like Ward on the roster to help fill a JYD role with an athlete. He's going to rebound, defend, cleanup on put-backs... an unheralded role, but I think he'd be at MINIMUM a Conditt replacement with a higher upside potential.
This guy reminds me of a 5 Oklahoma State would have. Probably not a lot of scoring, but has a ton of length that makes it hard to score in the paint.
Fwiw, Ward hasn't preformed quite to the level of Lard or McKay, and sophomore Conditt actually had better rebounding and block %s in 16 min/gm (compared to Ward's 20 min/gm).. Where do you get the higher upside potential? He's a senior, so I think what we see is likely what we get.
I'd be content with a gc level of player, especially if the plan is still to add another big. I think it's a upgrade though. It's similar to the Williams signing, he is a safe way to hedge our bets that we can be a similar team to last year. It's just as much about not letting the floor drop as it is raising the ceiling.
Conditt was a better player offensively this year in the B12 than Ward was at VCU, George shot the ball better, had a better offensive rebounding rate, and generated far more assists. Both guys turned it over a lot, too. Not gonna try to quantify defense through analytics and think Ward will be good in that regard.
Maybe Ward does improve in a new role on a new team, and if he comes to Iowa State I hope he does. I just don't think you can say he'd be at minimum an improvement over George, especially on offense.
As long as Ward can have at least 1-2 moving screens or baffling fouls 30' from the hoop per game, we'll be fine.
Last edited:
I said he'd be a replacement for Conditt, in other words that Ward would be an equivalent player to him.
My projection for a higher upside is that Ward appears he could actually dribble the ball, more athletic of a body type than Conditt. Conditt was mostly limited to passing out of the post. I just think Ward would fit into what we saw out of the offense a little bit better than did either of our bigs last year -- Ward looks like he would be pretty effective in a high post or P&R action, moving without the ball.
Even if Ward doesn't project "more than" Conditt, I think he could be a great addition and would be a fun guy to watch in a JYD role for the frontcourt rotation. He wouldn't be a starter here, hopefully, whereas we needed Conditt to start normally.
If TJ & Staff are recruiting Ward they have a significant role in mind for him. If Ward can guard in space great.
But modern defenses are designed to be pretty flexible. If Ward can guard in space, then that helps by adding another guy who can switch on perimeter screens. But TJ can also design the defense where our post hedges, but then drops back as the post defender.
I agree we might not see our high post offense run through our 5, it could just as easily run through Tre King or Jaz Kunc. Then keep the 5 in the low-post. Based on the guys TJ is recruiting, I think our pace of play will pick-up considerably next year.
This video gives me Kelvin Cado flashbacks, and that's a very good thing.
