FOX and ESPN have EXCLUSIVE negotiating rights from what I've read. That means they can't talk to ANYONE else unless Fox and ESPN give up those rights.
Big 12/ Pac 12 Merger (keep all the teams)
- Thread starter HawaiiClone
- Start date
No, they can't. That would never, ever hold up in court and would be a violation of the exclusivity agreement with Fox and ESPN. Yormark would be talking on behalf of the Big XII whether he has officially started his job or not. That's not going to fly.
LOL. NBC wouldn't be meeting with the Big 12, they'd be meeting with Yormark, who doesn't start until 8/1.
Besides, that is not how the world works. When do you think OUT started talking with SEC?
Yormark talking to NBC is not illegal. And ND talking with NBC about wanting the Big 18 teamed with them on Saturdays is not illegal. No one from the Big 12 is negotiating. It is an exclusive bidding window, not an exclusive talking window. NBC has not made a bid, has not negotiated,
Talking through the press is standard operating procedure. We're seeing it in the ACC too
Yeah like that doesn't go on behind the scenes anyway. It's not a period covered by any existing contract. They just can't contract for that period.
This is an important point. There are likely going to be additions that do not help from a per team revenue perspective, but lock up regions in the Big 12 that can help secure playoff access down the road. Nothing is guaranteed, but if you had all of AZ, CO, Utah, KS in the Big 12, that would help.
My only concern is if the Big 12 gets too picky and focuses on scratching out an extra couple mil per team, could it leave enough of an opening for the BIG and SEC to grab say U of A, Utah, Stanford, Oregon and Washington now, and then figure out a way to get the ACC dissolved and snatch the best few out of that league. Then they might figure they are at a good enough number and geographical reach between the two to have a 40-48 team breakaway league with some B12 poaching.
I like the idea of trying to lock up reasonable deals with the both AZ schools, Utah and CO for that reason.
Yep, I'm sure ESPN and Fox will just roll over and let that happen. NBC can talk all they want through their 'back channels' and 'third parties' but they can't sign anything for a year and a half.
In that timespan NBC might already get a part of the B1G. Then what? Or ESPN and Fox could come to terms on a new deal with the Big XII. If NBC doesn't get the Big Ten then ESPN and Fox still have a big head start on negotiating with the Big XII.
There isn't much that makes sense with Dodd's report. Especially when everyone else is saying NBC is still in deep talks with the Big Ten. If NBC is talking to the Big XII, they might just be gathering info, but I wouldn't take it seriously yet.
Exactly. The problem with “any port in a storm” is the longer the storm goes on , the fewer the ports.
Yep. They can talk. Big 12 might have a helluva deal lined up once the negotiation window closes for ESPN FOX who won’t be in a position to low ball. Lots of good quality inventory across many time zones. Big 12 will be well aware of their situation. Lock down the Arizona schools. Take Colorado if they want to come. Utah might then change their mind. PAC 12 is a sinking ship that is going to be on a tier slightly above G5. No Man’s Land. Twilight Zone. Not much of a future in PAC 12.
You said "their only hope was a merger".
The PAC can't remain a conference and stay at 10 or add teams?
Yep. They can remain. And make slightly more than Mountain West teams make now.
What, do you think, is comparable between the PAC in 2022 and the Big XII in 2021?
I see three key differences:
- The Big 10 and SEC have taken who they want from the Big XII. Okie Lite is the only future defection that seems remotely plausible, and I think the SEC would have grabbed them along with Oklahoma last year. There's nobody left that really fits the Big 10 expansion mold in the Big XII. There are five that might fit that mold in the ACC and PAC (WA, OR, Stanford, VA, NC). It makes far more sense that the Big 10 is patient and gets who they want rather than grab random pieces that don't fit perfectly.
- The new(est)-look Big XII is projected to get around $40m per school in a media deal. The current-look PAC-12 was projected at $30-35. The post-USCLA PAC-10-again are projected around $20-25m.
- The Big XII took the four best G5 adds last year. There's nobody left for the PAC to add that wouldn't further shrink that pie - San Diego St, Boise St, UNLV, Fresno St, Memphis, Colorado St are not going to add appreciable value now or in the future. And that's setting aside the issue of the PAC swallowing it's academic pride and taking any of those schools. Academics were a big reason the PAC nixed a Big XII merger last year, and those schools are mostly another step down. This year the Big XII nixed a PAC merger because the numbers didn't make sense for Big XII members. There's no reason to think similar talk with the ACC would yield a different outcome.
Roll over and let what happen? You've yet to prove your straw man that negotiations have occurred between Big 12 and NBC. They have not. No one said anything about signing. You're reading what you want to read.
Dodds tweet should make perfect sense to those like you- NBC just talked to the Big 12 through the press. Which is an approach to getting market value out there.
Choices for the PAC as a conference:
Option #1 - stay at 10 teams and make $10-$15m less than the Big XII and ACC. Hope the Big 10 doesn't come back for WA/OR/Stanford (unless you're WA, OR or Stanford and this is a good way to keep yourself available with an affordable GOR should an invite to the Big 10 come through).
Option #2 - add some MWC or other G5 teams and make $15-$25m less than the Big XII and ACC. Additional benefit of making that decision to pass on merging with the Angry 8 for academic reasons last year look really, really, silly.
Choices for between 4 and 7 PAC schools:
Option #1 - Stick with the PAC and know the best-case scenario is making $10-$15m less than you could elsewhere.
Option #2 - take the ACC up on a membership offer and make more money. Rest assured the conference membership is stable until the early 2030s when some of the more valuable schools might get poached by the SEC and Big 10 (unless you're WA, OR or Stanford and your GOR is now open at exactly the time the Big 10 and SEC are likely to make more acquisitions).
Option #3 - take the Big XII up on a membership offer and make more money. Rest assured that membership is pretty stable and that the SEC might come for one school (Okie Lite) someday, but the Big 10 is probably done with your conference (unless you're WA, OR or Stanford and they come for you).
I hate to see orphaned teams, especially since Iowa State was facing that possibility, but the fact that the Big XII walked away from merger talks indicates our new commissioner is willing to play hardball. That's what it takes in today's environment. I would think any remaining PAC XII schools would see joining the Big XII as better than going down with the ship.
Really the Pac gives off the weak conference appearance.
USC and UCLA leave for the Big Ten- fail
“Let’s start an alliance with the ACC” fails
“Fine Big 12, we’ll do an alliance with you” fails
And this is all in just a few weeks! Phil Knight is begging the Big Ten to take Oregon. Desperation at its finest.
Pac is toast, it’s amazing how many national media keep spinning it that the Pac is fine.
If the B1G or SEC want any team in any conference other than the B1G/SEC, they will have them, period. Nothing we can do.
The comparison is at the macro level.
In 2021 when Texas and OU's departure leaked, almost every fan base of the remaining 8 teams was panicked. In the days following the announcement we didn't know we'd be able to bring in the 4 new members.
In 2022 the fan bases of most PAC schools are panicked.
The uncertainty is comparable. Stating with a straight face "the PAC is toast" or similar statements is simply a hot take.
You can look for and find minutia to say "this is different" and you are correct. But it's much more similar than not.
Not totally true. We had done an expansion look just a year or so before and it was shot down (guessing by OuT). So we know how we stood with several schools and which ones were the best to add.
