Very sobering graph to say the least but the argument for throwing out a year or two of anyone’s career is flawed. You can’t simply discount prohms job over that time period (don’t take this as me backing up Prohm either because I’m not).
Prohm Defenders
- Thread starter Liam4Cy
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Very sobering graph to say the least but the argument for throwing out a year or two of anyone’s career is flawed. You can’t simply discount prohms job over that time period (don’t take this as me backing up Prohm either because I’m not).
Sure, but prohm defenders have spent years blaming prohms third year slump on Fred not having a strong recruiting class for that year. Ao if defenders can throw out prohms bad year and blame freds lack of recruiting, then why cant we discount the years fred left him with a preseason top 10 team? Not many coaches get to walk into a stacked roster like prohm did.
So if Campbell doesn't get a big payday for he and his staff - he leaves? Really? Didn't think he was that kind of guy.
He actually had some young talent that year that at times competed and looked pretty good. Wigginton and Lard complimented one another very well at times.
Issue being there's not much for long-term impact there from either one, obviously.
I acknowledge where the program sits. But do the same points need to be debated over and over all season? I know, I don't have to read it, but it's in every mbb thread. In-game, post-game, recruiting, etc, all turn into "Prohm sucks." I get it. Wish we could just let the season play out.
Sorry, I haven't read all the posts so this might be redundant. I met my first in person Prohm defender recently. Although he made some valid points all I could keep thinking was we are on the verge of our 3rd losing season in the last 4 seasons. I just can't believe this acceptable or that it should be acceptable no matter the reasons. Results have to matter.
exactly Prohm was handed the keys to a Corvette and came back in a Chevette as of now.. where as Campbell was given a Cavalier and is now driving a Camaro..
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There should not be any sort of thread with Prohms name and a form of defense in it. In fact, it's actually offensive.
CycloneErik
Well-Known Member
Prohm still coached the guys that year though. He played a part in getting them to where they went that year.
To me it’s just like the argument that if breece rattled off 140 yards on 20 carries but one of them was an 80 yard run (where maybe the defense guessed wrong on a blitz and he went untouched). People make the argument that if you take away that 80 yard run, his game isn’t that great. My point is though that it’s all a part of the game. Breece was toting the rock all of those 140 yards. The same can be said for Prohm and coaching. Once he stepped foot on campus, he was the man and those wins and losses became a part of his record.
Sure let's say those first two seasons were 100% due to CSP's brilliance. Brilliant enough to do zero of his "coaching" and make those historically awesome teams worse.
Since then we've had catastrophic failures in player chemistry, behavior, and retainment. On the court play and in game adjustments have been terrible. We've seen the worst statistical losses in several categories, and some of the worst seasons in decades.
Prohm is worse than McDermott, but Pollard made a colossal blunder by giving him a huge extension for winning the big 12 tourney in an otherwise underperforming year.
People keep saying he's such a fantastic recruiter but I disagree. If your recruits leave and they don't work together to win as a team while they're here, is it really good recruiting? Are those the players we want at ISU? If most of your recruits one year don't even make it to campus, are you really a good recruiter? If your transfers mostly are players that wouldn't start at any other big 12 school, are you really a good recruiter?
Don't get me wrong, I disagree with Sullivan regarding the "we should recruit iowa kids" thing. His argument is literally stupid. Who cares where the kids come from as long as they come here to play and want to win FOR ISU. The problem is all the kids recently don't give a **** about ISU and just want to get to the NBA ASAP. That's garbage recruiting for a school like ISU and we're reaping what Prohm is sewing. ****.
It's sowing. Reaping what you are sowing. Like reaping is harvesting the seeds you sow. You sow seeds and sew with a needle.
No, the wins were not 100% on his brilliance and nor were the losses 100% on him either. Like I said in the second sentence of my post; he played a part in it.
How Fred left didn't help, but Steve had a lot to do with that third year. However I don't even know why we are again rehashing this. Outside of the jihad wing of fire Steve Prohm, most have agreed the third season was Steve's mulligan. Every coach gets at least one. Well, unless your name is Greg and the CF founders think you are just a really swell guy. That being said, there is no need to discount anything good that has happened under Steve because enough bad has happened you don't need to discount the good. Unless of course your objective is to never be objective. Then, as long as Steve is here you will be part of the miserable masses that say every win is an accident, and every loss is historic....regardless of record.
I have historically been a pretty staunch Prohm defender, but even I can't defend his tenure now.
However, I really don't like the quoted sentence, particularly the bolded part. I think that before that season most fans would have been happy with an NCAA six seed and a Big 12 tournament win, even with a first round NCAA loss. The "underperforming" was a result of changing expectations after the team was playing really well.
You can't discredit that team by saying they underperformed without crediting them for first raising the expectations.
Edit:
Expectations for 2018-2019
What are realistic expectations for next years team? I hate looking past the rest of this season, especially for a guy like Donovan, but this year is just a couple games from being over with the likelihood of no post-season play. Hines responded to someone on twitter recently telling them to...
cyclonefanatic.com
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Recruiting is a lot more than talent identification and getting an elite player every couple years. Being a good recruiter more importantly, means building a talented roster.
That means recruiting quality posts as well as quality guards. It means have shot blockers, rebounders, defenders and shooters.
It means having some strong leaders and some guys who can be complimentary personalities. It means having some different personaliities- steady Eddie's and some guys who play with an edge.
To be an upper level team, a coach needs a roster than goes 7-8 players deep and guys skill sets and personalities compliment each other.
That's why there are so few great coaches who win consistently over a 20 year period. Being a great recruiter is much more than individual players, it about the roster composition each year.
IMO that is where Coach Hoiberg excelled at ISU.
