MONDAY MUSINGS: Hoops thoughts, football coaching changes, don't be a jackass

[BillBrasky4Cy]

Well Prohm is a little further than 1.5 years in. His record with his own players isn’t great. Honest question, where do you see us finishing in the Big 12 this year?

The 2017-2018 season should in no shape or form be used against Prohm. He walked into a roster that was a scholarship disaster. I get that people are frustrated with how this year is going and it's fair but damn, stop putting so much weight into the 2017-2018 season.

 

[rochclone]

I have no idea if you’re right. You could be. But you have an agenda.

and didn’t most people think we’d get conditt? That wasn’t exactly a hard thing to guess.

asshat.

My “agenda” is to keep this program in the Top 25-35 which is where it has resided 7 of the last 9 years. I feel I did that when JP asked for the re-seating. JP demanded more from the long time season ticket holders in order to keep CFH. A year later he went the fiscally conservative route after asking the season ticket holder to pony up. I don’t care who the coach is as long as we win. I wrote in November that getting this team and next years team to the tournament would make CSP the most decorated coach in ISU history. I want them to win I don’t care if that is Prohm or someone else.

 

[Gossamer]

I think that might have a little to do with him being the winningest coach in our schools history, idk.

no, I think it had to do with his history with ISU...but splitting hairs.

 

[BillBrasky4Cy]

My agenda is to keep this program in the Top 25-35 which is where it has resided 7 of the last 9 years. I’ve done that when JP asked for the re-seating. JP demanded more from the long time season holder in order to keep CFH. A year later he went the fiscally conservative route after asking the season ticket holder to pony up. I don’t care who the coach as long as we win. I wrote in November that getting this team and next years team to the tournament would make CSP the most decorated coach in ISU history. I want them to win I don’t care if that is Prohm or someone else.

 

[simply1]

Could it be possible that Lewis was responsible for Florida a&m not missing a shot down the stretch?

I’d just like our insider to comment. Thanks for yours though.

 

[rochclone]

I do sort of feel that way

 

[isufbcurt]

Oh, you're trying to tell me that a banked in 3 shot from Plano wasn't skill?

It's skill from an opponent but luck when it's ISU.

I'd be curious to see if people think Naz's 3 against OSU at home was luck or great coaching.

 

[aeroclone]

I'm laughing because when we (ISU) has even 1/2 the success and prestige as KU does in basketball then this is a fair comparison.

You are missing my point. I'm saying the measure of success for a coach is fluid. The bar is not the same at KU as ISU, true. But it is also not the same at KU between seasons or at ISU between seasons. Evaluating whether a coach did well in a season is a moving standard based on the school, the roster, the rest of the league, etc.

Twins is making the case that last year was a success simply because we had a 6 seed. I would say it was indeed a good end result by historical ISU standards, but it was underachieving based on how the year played out. We had better talent relative to the league than 9-9 for 5th place. We had better talent than to have several losses at Hilton. That team had better talent than 1 and done in the NCAA. The B12 tourney win was great, but in my opinion bigger picture last year Prohm underdelivered given what he had and what he was up against.

 

[Clonefan32]

I'm not sure, but I am sure I will be at every home game and watch every away game cheering them on.

I guess this is kind of what I was talking about with my prior comment that to some Prohm is above reproach. I guess I don't get countering criticisms with "support the team" comments. Can't you do both? You can cheer on the team but also have concerns about the direction of the program. These are not mutually exclusive concepts.

 

[CyTwins]

It's skill from an opponent but luck when it's ISU.

I'd be curious to see if people think Naz's 3 against OSU at home was luck or great coaching.

Hoiberg prevented Forte from making that free throw instead of losing at Hilton on Kane and Ejims senior night!

 

[herbicide]

Well it depends on what numbers you look at.

A case could be made for Larry because of the Elite 8, but his over all numbers with 2 9th place and 1 10th place finish is 5 years are not a good look.

A case could be made for Fred if you look at win percentage and resurrection of excitement for ISU basketball.

A case could be made for Floyd if you look at win percentage and consistency, but the 11th place in his final year is a black eye.

Either way it's not roses and unicorns of basketball history that some believe.

For the sake of discussion his final year was screwed over by the NCAA not clearing CJ Bruton, and wasn't helped by the other recruiting losses. I personally give him a pass on that season just as I give Prohm a pass on 17-18.

 

[SpokaneCY]

I don’t believe in pointing fingers and calling out these 21 yrs olds, but is questioning Coach Prohm inability to take this program to where it deserves(legit contender as Fred left it) also qualifies as being a bad fan?

Remind me of all the banners Fred is responsible for at ISU? If none, how about with the Timberwolves? If none, how about the Bulls? If none, what seed do you predict Nebraska will get this year? If you don't think they make a tourney, what high level grad transfers will he have exclusive access to since he invented the grad transfer market?

I'm curious if the cut and run crowd treat other parts of their lives the same way - investments, sick parents and animals, girlfriends...

Important life lesson - you never want to panic. But you NEVER want to be the LAST one to panic. I think the panic train is starting to fill up with promises of national championship banners being lost while we idle away doing nothing.

During one of the market melt-downs last year, a top-notch investment dude when asked about what we should do said:

Don't just DO something - stand there!

 

[rochclone]

It's skill from an opponent but luck when it's ISU.

I'd be curious to see if people think Naz's 3 against OSU at home was luck or great coaching.

TCU shot was luck. People don’t try and bank in 30 foot shots. Naz’s shot was skill not coaching or luck.

 

[SpokaneCY]

Where was my invite

He figured since your wife was dancing you'd already be there? Sorry - couldn't engage my filter fast enough to NOT post that.

 

[isufbcurt]

I guess this is kind of what I was talking about with my prior comment that to some Prohm is above reproach. I guess I don't get countering criticisms with "support the team" comments. Can't you do both? You can cheer on the team but also have concerns about the direction of the program. These are not mutually exclusive concepts.

I don't think he is above reproach at all. There are many things I question, but then there are also positives I see. Just because I support the coach and team doesn't mean I think he is above reproach, it simply means I'm going to support whoever and whatever takes the court because me complaining about every little thing isn't going to impact any decisions by the AD.

 

[EarthIsMan]

13-24 in the Big 12.

Context is important and I think the points are:
a) Prohm has proven that he can recruit at the HS, JC, and transfer levels
b) Prohm should get a lot of credit for the successes of 2016 and 2017 with flawed rosters, personnel management, etc.
c) Winning is winning and Prohm was 101-29 with his "own players" while at Murray St.
d) Everyone knows why the single year of 2018 is a flawed year to use as an indictment against an entire resume.
d) Prohm is not perfect.
e) Expectations should be realistic.

 

[SpokaneCY]

The margin of error at Iowa State will always be smaller than a gnat’s pecker.

Win in the margins is what some say.

 

[CyTwins]

You are missing my point. I'm saying the measure of success for a coach is fluid. The bar is not the same at KU as ISU, true. But it is also not the same at KU between seasons or at ISU between seasons. Evaluating whether a coach did well in a season is a moving standard based on the school, the roster, the rest of the league, etc.

Twins is making the case that last year was a success simply because we had a 6 seed. I would say it was indeed a good end result by historical ISU standards, but it was underachieving based on how the year played out. We had better talent relative to the league than 9-9 for 5th place. We had better talent than to have several losses at Hilton. That team had better talent than 1 and done in the NCAA. The B12 tourney win was great, but in my opinion bigger picture last year Prohm underdelivered given what he had and what he was up against.

It's kind of foolish to say he underdelivered given what he had when he brought what we had in

 

[isufbcurt]

TCU shot was luck. People don’t try and bank in 30 foot shots. Naz’s shot was skill not coaching or luck.

what about this one?

 

[CyTwins]

TCU shot was luck. People don’t try and bank in 30 foot shots. Naz’s shot was skill not coaching or luck.

Forte missing that FT to give us that shot was_____?