What was to be and the New Offensive Coordinator

[CyBelieve]

Agreed D UP Clones. With this kind of track record I can see why the Cyclone Faithful don't want to see Loney here again.

"Loney enjoyed three coaching stints at his alma mater Iowa State as the offensive coordinator and offensive line coach (1995-97, 2000-01). During his third stay with the Cyclones, Loney’s offense produced back-to-back bowl seasons in 2000 and 2001. In 2001, the Cyclones averaged 423.1 yards total offense per game and 26.9 points per outing. In 2000 his offense averaged 424.4 yards per game, the third-best total in school history.

Loney was the offensive coordinator and offensive line coach at the University of Minnesota in 1998 and 1999. Under Loney’s guidance in 1999, Minnesota was second in the Big Ten Conference and 11th in the nation in rushing offense. The Golden Gophers averaged 415.4 offensive yards and 31.6 points per game. In addition to setting five school records in 1999, Loney’s offense produced All-Big Ten first team rusher Thomas Hamer (1,326 yards) and first-team All-American center Ben Hamilton.

From 1995-97, Loney was offensive coordinator and offensive line coach at Iowa State, where he produced the only tailback in NCAA history to rush for a pair of 2,000-yard seasons in 1995 and 1996, Heisman Trophy finalist Troy Davis. Troy’s brother, Darren, followed that feat with 1,005 yards rushing in nine games in 1997."

 

[JCloned2]

Re: My response is no Kidding? sarcasm

Anyone who believes you can line up in a pro set and beat people at ISU is a complete fool. Chizik was a fool and never got "it."

I lobbied for Loney and Rhoads the first time around. I had hoped Chizik could actually coach and didn't just rely on great athletes. Unfortunately, he was what I expected.

And to the Loney basher, LOL, dude you have no clue. The guy had the best offense ISU has ever had and ran the spread better than most teams. Loney has proven he can flat out get it done at ISU. No other name you have has proven that and that is HUGE.

Enough about that because you obviously don't get "it."

ISU has to run the spread. The quarterback has to run the ball and the ocoordinater has to be an "in game coach." It's not enough to draw it up in practice if you don't know when to use it in the game.

I agree that the OC hire will be the biggest one Rhoads makes. We unfortunately won't be lucky enough to get Loney back. You never really know if these guys can coach until you get them here. Some are a product of their talent at their level and the coaches they work with.

I hope Rhoads can find another Loney who can bring back great offense to ISU.

Wow where to start. Loney did not run anything close to the offenses that I am talking about. Lining up occasionally with 4 or 5 wide is not a spread offense. Loney could get it done years ago, but not now. RMac isn't the bad coordinator you describe, he doesn't have the philosophy that ISU was going to move to, outside of some peculiar play calling at times - some of which is directly due to Chizik being extremely risk averse. Finally while I am no fonder of Chizik then I suspect you are the reality is he did get, albeit late as I said.

 

[kingcy]

Re: My response is no Kidding? sarcasm

And to the Loney basher, LOL, dude you have no clue. The guy had the best offense ISU has ever had and ran the spread better than most teams. Loney has proven he can flat out get it done at ISU. No other name you have has proven that and that is HUGE.

Loney also had two of the QBs in ISU history to work with and the 2nd best back in ISU history to work with when he was OC. The recievers and line wasnt bad either. When he was Oline coach he had the best back in ISU history and one of the best if not the best back ever in college FB running behind his line. Yes he would be an ok hire as OC but PR has to think outside the box a little. Loney's play calling wasnt all that great and very stright forward. Mac wanted every OC after him to run what Loney did and it didnt really work the greatest.

The three things that bugged me about Chizik is he didnt always play the best players, his gametime coaching wasnt good, and he acted like he didnt want to be here at times, doing somethings just because he had to.

 

[jumbopackage]

Re: My response is no Kidding? sarcasm

Anyone who believes you can line up in a pro set and beat people at ISU is a complete fool. Chizik was a fool and never got "it."

I lobbied for Loney and Rhoads the first time around. I had hoped Chizik could actually coach and didn't just rely on great athletes. Unfortunately, he was what I expected.

And to the Loney basher, LOL, dude you have no clue. The guy had the best offense ISU has ever had and ran the spread better than most teams. Loney has proven he can flat out get it done at ISU. No other name you have has proven that and that is HUGE.

Enough about that because you obviously don't get "it."

ISU has to run the spread. The quarterback has to run the ball and the ocoordinater has to be an "in game coach." It's not enough to draw it up in practice if you don't know when to use it in the game.

I agree that the OC hire will be the biggest one Rhoads makes. We unfortunately won't be lucky enough to get Loney back. You never really know if these guys can coach until you get them here. Some are a product of their talent at their level and the coaches they work with.

I hope Rhoads can find another Loney who can bring back great offense to ISU.

Loney proved he could kinda get it done, the emphasis being could. It's past tense. The Big XII of today isn't quite the Big XII of 5 years ago - especially the Big XII North. Loney coached teams at ISU are 0-15 against ranked teams.

Obviously there are no guarantees going forward, but just because a guy "did it" at ISU 5 years ago, doesn't mean he will do it today.

 

[kingcy]

Re: My response is no Kidding? sarcasm

RMac isn't the bad coordinator you describe, he doesn't have the philosophy that ISU was going to move to, outside of some peculiar play calling at times - some of which is directly due to Chizik being extremely risk averse.

RMac's biggest problem was Chizik wanted to run the ball no matter what and RMac has a history of throwing the ball all over the place. They had way different ideas on how the ofense should be ran. I really think RMac is the big loser in all of this if he isnt kept on as Oline coach.

 

[Wesley]

Seems like some logical deductions. But if Chiz couldn't bring in athletes for a good defense how was he going to bring them in for a high scoring offense?

Because offensive players have a good time oin the Big 12.

 

[Wesley]

I think Gene thought he could win six a year and he was wrong, so he bailed at his third opportunity. He also interviewed two other positions. Did anyone know what those other two schools were? Anyway, JP knew it was just a matter of time before gene flew the coop. i am not even sure Gene wanted to talk to high school coaches or make the Cyclone preseason rounds with the public. He probably lost out on lots oif recruits that reinforced his desire to move. He could have kept his family down South and stayed in a motel room.

 

[jumbopackage]

Another Loney stat:
Record against teams with a greater than .500 winning percentage:
95-97 - 1-18 (UNI)
00-01 - 5-7 (Pitt, Ohio, UNLV, Iowa, UNI)

Average points scored against those teams:
95-97 - 18.1
00-01 - 23.3

 

[kingcy]

I think Gene thought he could win six a year and he was wrong, so he bailed at his third opportunity. He also interviewed two other positions. Did anyone know what those other two schools were?

No please tell us.

 

[D UP Clones]

Re: My response is no Kidding? sarcasm

Then you don't know what a spread offense is. A spread offense is lining up with those receivers and having your quarterback also run the ball. Loney's offense's did that.

You are talking about the run and shoot which many of these offenses are actually running. Offenses have been throwing it around for several years and it wasn't called the spread.

It's only a spread if you take advantage of the quarterback running the ball and that is the true advantage of the spread offense.

Oh, and to the other poster, how good was ISU with Seneca the year after Loney left. Wow, you guys have no clue. Winning is about coaching and talent. At ISU you can't win without a good OC and Loney was a good OC.

End of story. Your bs excuses about different big twelve make me laugh. You're right Nebraska isn't nearly as good. neither is Colorado, or Kstate, etc. I could go on all day.

The big twelve north is weaker now than it has every been.

PS What's funny to me is many of you thought this Malzahn coach has proven something at TULSA. LOL You're killing me with this balony. Holy cow!

 

[D UP Clones]

Re: My response is no Kidding? sarcasm

Oh, and one more thing, you guys couldn't be more wrong about who wanted to throw the ball this year. I know for a fact about a couple of conversations that happened between Mac and Chizik during games. One was during the horrible offensive performance in the Nebraska game. McFarland is on record saying he thought going simple would help. What a dumb move!

And when Loney was at ISU he coached for a very conservative McCarney. McCarney was constantly telling Loney to run the ball late in games and to be conservative. This philosophy eventually cost Mac his job as the Kansas loss and Missouriy loss were both pitiful and perfect examples if McCarney's conservative problems.

Anyone who thought ISU was well coached on offense this year flat out doesn't know what a good offense looks like. It was pathetic and has been pathetic for two years now.

 

[JCloned2]

For the comments on offenses vs. defense and also

Some stats for you then... In 2005 there were 3 teams averaging 40 points per game, 2006 1 team 2007 7 teams 2008 11 teams.

Total scoring is up a little over 10 percent since 2004 & 2005 which were nearly identical. The big difference is at the top. The top teams are scoring more and the number of teams scoring big point totals is growing

 

[JCloned2]

Re: My response is no Kidding? sarcasm

Then you don't know what a spread offense is. A spread offense is lining up with those receivers and having your quarterback also run the ball. Loney's offense's did that.

You are talking about the run and shoot which many of these offenses are actually running. Offenses have been throwing it around for several years and it wasn't called the spread.

It's only a spread if you take advantage of the quarterback running the ball and that is the true advantage of the spread offense.

Oh, and to the other poster, how good was ISU with Seneca the year after Loney left. Wow, you guys have no clue. Winning is about coaching and talent. At ISU you can't win without a good OC and Loney was a good OC.

End of story. Your bs excuses about different big twelve make me laugh. You're right Nebraska isn't nearly as good. neither is Colorado, or Kstate, etc. I could go on all day.

The big twelve north is weaker now than it has every been.

PS What's funny to me is many of you thought this Malzahn coach has proven something at TULSA. LOL You're killing me with this balony. Holy cow!

Your ignorance of the what is going on in todays offenses is readily apparent by your posts. It isn't nearly as simple as what you are describing. Do some homework and then comeback with something and we can talk until then lose the attitude. You are what is wrong with most sites today and why I left in the first place.

 

[jumbopackage]

Re: My response is no Kidding? sarcasm

Then you don't know what a spread offense is. A spread offense is lining up with those receivers and having your quarterback also run the ball. Loney's offense's did that.

You are talking about the run and shoot which many of these offenses are actually running. Offenses have been throwing it around for several years and it wasn't called the spread.

It's only a spread if you take advantage of the quarterback running the ball and that is the true advantage of the spread offense.

Oh, and to the other poster, how good was ISU with Seneca the year after Loney left. Wow, you guys have no clue. Winning is about coaching and talent. At ISU you can't win without a good OC and Loney was a good OC.

End of story. Your bs excuses about different big twelve make me laugh. You're right Nebraska isn't nearly as good. neither is Colorado, or Kstate, etc. I could go on all day.

The big twelve north is weaker now than it has every been.

PS What's funny to me is many of you thought this Malzahn coach has proven something at TULSA. LOL You're killing me with this balony. Holy cow!

The Big-12 teams that Loney beat in his magical 2000 and 2001 seasons?
A combined 14-58 in conference. He NEVER beat a team with a winning conference record. In fact, the BEST teams he beat in the Big 12 were 3-5 Colorado in 2000 and 3-5 Missouri in 2001.

The 5 wins in the Big XII in 2000 were against Baylor (0-8), Okie State (1-7), Missouri (2-6), Colorado (3-5) and Kansas (2-6).

The 4 conference wins in 2001 were Baylor (0-8), Missouri (3-5), Oklahoma State (2-6) and Kansas (1-7).

Those teams are all much, much better than they were then. Baylor is much improved, and Missouri, Okie State and KU are all in bowl games this year. Sure you can say "well, K-State and Nebraska aren't as good as they were then", but they are still decent - Nebraska is bowling this year, and colorado and K-state were only one win away from going bowling this year too.

Loney's teams won games they should have won. I guess there's something to be said for that, but, watching them, you always knew that going up against the big boys, you never really had a shot.

 

[JCloned2]

Agreed D UP Clones. With this kind of track record I can see why the Cyclone Faithful don't want to see Loney here again.

"Loney enjoyed three coaching stints at his alma mater Iowa State as the offensive coordinator and offensive line coach (1995-97, 2000-01). During his third stay with the Cyclones, Loney’s offense produced back-to-back bowl seasons in 2000 and 2001. In 2001, the Cyclones averaged 423.1 yards total offense per game and 26.9 points per outing. In 2000 his offense averaged 424.4 yards per game, the third-best total in school history.

Loney was the offensive coordinator and offensive line coach at the University of Minnesota in 1998 and 1999. Under Loney’s guidance in 1999, Minnesota was second in the Big Ten Conference and 11th in the nation in rushing offense. The Golden Gophers averaged 415.4 offensive yards and 31.6 points per game. In addition to setting five school records in 1999, Loney’s offense produced All-Big Ten first team rusher Thomas Hamer (1,326 yards) and first-team All-American center Ben Hamilton.

From 1995-97, Loney was offensive coordinator and offensive line coach at Iowa State, where he produced the only tailback in NCAA history to rush for a pair of 2,000-yard seasons in 1995 and 1996, Heisman Trophy finalist Troy Davis. Troy’s brother, Darren, followed that feat with 1,005 yards rushing in nine games in 1997."

You are making my point. His best year at either Minnesota or ISU would have ranked 9th in scoring offense in the Big 12 this year. Do you think that is good enough to get it done at ISU? Offenses have changed like it or not it is a score or go home world right now especially for a school will be building a defense

 

[D UP Clones]

Re: My response is no Kidding? sarcasm

Your ignorance of the what is going on in todays offenses is readily apparent by your posts. It isn't nearly as simple as what you are describing. Do some homework and then comeback with something and we can talk until then lose the attitude. You are what is wrong with most sites today and why I left in the first place.

LOL You call me ignorant and you have posted absolutely nothing explaining why what you describe is the spread offense. LOL

Yeah, I'm the problem. LOL I like proven coaches. Crazy, I know. I like watching the spread which involves a running quarterback which takes advantage of the defense losing a man out of the box. The offense gains an advantage it otherwise doesn't have. Crazy, again LOL.

Break it down for me X and O man. I would really like for you to explain the spread offense to me. Oh, and spare me the football knowledge bit because I doubt you have spent any more time on a football field as a coach or player.

Come back when you can actually speak intelligently about offense and not in general terms like most on here do.

I noticed you completely ignored the changes in the big twelve north especially at Nebraska.

 

[kingcy]

Re: My response is no Kidding? sarcasm

LOL You call me ignorant and you have posted absolutely nothing explaining why what you describe is the spread offense. LOL

Yeah, I'm the problem. LOL I like proven coaches. Crazy, I know. I like watching the spread which involves a running quarterback which takes advantage of the defense losing a man out of the box. The offense gains an advantage it otherwise doesn't have. Crazy, again LOL.

Break it down for me X and O man. I would really like for you to explain the spread offense to me. Oh, and spare me the football knowledge bit because I doubt you have spent any more time on a football field as a coach or player.

Come back when you can actually speak intelligently about offense and not in general terms like most on here do.

I noticed you completely ignored the changes in the big twelve north especially at Nebraska.

I'm glad someone knows it all and is blessing us with his wisdom, while calling us idiots. I am growing tired of that behavior here.

 

[D UP Clones]

Re: My response is no Kidding? sarcasm

I'm glad someone knows it all and is blessing us with his wisdom, while calling us idiots. I am growing tired of that behavior here.

These types of posts make me laugh. You tell me how I believe I know everything because I don't agree with your opinion in which you tell me what you know is right. Irony, look it up.

My point is simple. Arguing that a guy who has PROVEN to be a successful offensive coordinator is somehow not because you say so is the epitome of clueless.

I have no idea who ISU will hire as an offensive coordinator, but I do know who has won at ISU in that position. Knocking Loney ( a cyclone who won here) is beyond intelligent conversation. If you are offended by that, tough.

I get tired of reading about these "so called great coordinators" who have hardly done anything and that is putting it mildly.

It will be a huge hire for ISU though.

 

[kingcy]

Re: My response is no Kidding? sarcasm

These types of posts make me laugh. You tell me how I believe I know everything because I don't agree with your opinion in which you tell me what you know is right. Irony, look it up.

My point is simple. Arguing that a guy who has PROVEN to be a successful offensive coordinator is somehow not because you say so is the epitome of clueless.

I have no idea who ISU will hire as an offensive coordinator, but I do know who has won at ISU in that position. Knocking Loney ( a cyclone who won here) is beyond intelligent conversation. If you are offended by that, tough.

I get tired of reading about these "so called great coordinators" who have hardly done anything and that is putting it mildly.

It will be a huge hire for ISU though.

I never knocked Loney just stated facts on when he was here last. I never knocked him he would be an ok hire. I also feel there are others that would be good OCs. There those here that are respected posters and have earned that. There are others that want to be respected but go about it the wrong way. I dont know how you can call me out on my opinions and stating of facts is crazy since you are stating your opinions as facts.

 

[ketelmeister]

Why did this migrate to a discussion on Steve Loney. He won't be here, did a nice job here and the rest is history. Let's talk reality instead of shooting darts. Thanks.