What is sad is Bonds likely was a hall of famer even without the steroids. Clemens might have gotten close without steroids as well.
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He was great but hof? I dunno. I loved him in Stl, Redbird hof absolutely and he is in that.
He seems like a pretty consistently top 50 player year to year but yeah seems odd. Unless he's getting in on consistency.
Rolen was on the STL teams I first remember, I don’t think of him as a HOF’er. I think I’m stricter than most when it comes to HOF though.
Yes, third base is an undervalued position when it comes to the hall of fame. By far the best defensive third baseman of his time and the bat to boot
I remember Rolen being one of those thorns in the side of the Brewers. He was no D____ F_____, but still was a hard out.
Rolen was very good, but I don't think he's HOF worthy. .280 ba, 316 hr, 1287 rbi, and 2077 hits. He was a great defensive player, eight gold gloves.
I think a problem is we have to stop the stigma that only players who put up great offensive numbers should get in
I’m kind of torn on this…the steroid era rescued baseball after the disaster that was the 94 strike. Against the rules, yes but god knows where baseball would be without it.
I’m ok with Bonds not getting in though. It just seems that guy was so greedy. He was a hall of famer before steroids but he got greedy and that’s what ends up keeping him out.
The system is so screwed up that I can’t even take it seriously anymore. Im a huge baseball fan. I’ve been to Cooperstown. It makes me sad. We spend all this time talking about these guys and not about the game. Do they deserve to be in, no way IMO. But If you wanna put them in, put them in. Let’s just move on.
May have missed it among the HOF talk, but sounds like MLB actually tried being reasonable at the negotiation tables today. Still have a ways to go, but it sounds like today was more productive than I guess I would’ve expected out on Manfred.
Biggest slap in the face was raising minimum wage for first and second year players from $600,000 to $615,000, if I read it correctly. But I believe the MLBPA is asking for $1,000,000, which I also think is too steep.
Biggest slap in the face was raising minimum wage for first and second year players from $600,000 to $615,000, if I read it correctly. But I believe the MLBPA is asking for $1,000,000, which I also think is too steep.
They’re still a ways away of agreeing upon numbers but it is positive that they’ve met two days in a row and MLB is agreeing that it’s younger players need to be paid more.
And yet Pete Rose is not in the HOF.
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So the guy who was a scrub for Minnesota, moved to Boston started the juice and turned into a monster hitter gets into the HOF, but the guy who was a hall of famer, took the juice and became the greatest baseball player of all time isn't...good way to make your award irrelevant.
Exactly. Wasn't that in 2003 that he tested positive or "allegedly". He's a "nice" guy and on TV, etc.
The Hall of Fame is basically a popularity contest at this point. David Ortiz uses steroids and he gets in because he is well liked. Clemens and Bonds used steroids and don't get in because they are a**holes. The writers get to determine which cheaters get in.
I mean this is the career arc of Barry bonds too a little bit he wasn't a scrub with the pirates but was a solid player who hit 25 home runs a year for 7 years, then he moves to San Fran and jumps to a 40+ home run guy and his batting average jumps 30 points.
Another complaint about the baseball hall of fame is how selective they try to be. If you have multiple years that no hall of famers are selected, then the process needs to be reviewed. In my opinion, if you are considered the best/one of the best players at your position for multiple years, you are deserving of the hall of fame. Stop getting obsessed with stats and milestones (300 wins, 500 home runs, etc.) Those stats mean differently at times.
It’s why I think the sportswriters are a bunch of the worst kind of hypocrites. EVERYONE knew the players were juicing, but because baseball was in a sharp decline until these players started shattering records left and right, bringing an interest back to the game, EVERYONE turned a blind eye to what was going on and the media even celebrated it. Then Congress decided to investigate the players and the media hung them out to dry, turning them into villains overnight. Now, 20 years later, these same writers that celebrated what was going on at the time now stands on their soap boxes screaming at anyone who will listen “how dare we put these scum bags who cheated the legends out of their records into the Hall of Fame alongside them?”
I mean, it’s not like I like Bonds or McGuire or Clemens, and it’s not like them being left out of the Hall of Fame is any skin off my ass. It’s just the hypocrisy of the outrage out of the sportswriters really pisses me off, especially when David Ortiz is also a known steroid user and he gets in first ballot. That itself is the height of hypocrisy.
