***2024 US Open Golf Thread Pinehurst #2***
- Thread starter BigJCy
- Start date
Meh. I suppose. It's more competitive than LIV but I think even Scottie would tell you winning the RBC Heritage or something doesn't mean a whole lot to him anymore. The top guys are trying to win Majors and cash some checks in between. That's the reality on both tours.
The RBC Heritage had a higher payout than the PGA Championship. The PGA Signature events have some serious cash now.
Nope. Especially if I had the money that guys like Bryson, Rahm, Koepka, etc have. How greedy do you have to be?
PGA vs LIV used to interest me a bit but it does nothing for me anymore. These guys need to be on the course going head to head as much as possible for golf to be intresting.
You guys (and the guys in media) who talk about "sportswashing" are such dorks. First of all, the point of the supposed term would be that it would turn public sentiment and "wash" away all the bad, which it clearly won't actually do unless you have an incredibly smooth brain. Besides that, I don't think they care about what the world opinion is so long as they have a seat at the table. The other thing is almost to a man, the sportswashing warriors will also poo-poo any other entity brought up like China or any other entity that is involved in the sports or entertainment world so they are essentially actively sportswashing. Now, the golf media and PGA Tour certainly provided the narrative here and really it's just the latest attempt to appeal to emotion.
All that said, LIV absolutely sucks as a product. Just completely soulless golf. The part that really sucks is they've also neutered the PGA Tour (with the help of broadcast partners) to the point where it's not really a watchable product anymore. Combine all that with Tiger essentially being a footnote and providing a week a year to the Tour, and there's a big adjustment coming. If the like of Cantlay, Tiger, et al. belive they're going to find even remotely similar money for the PGA Tour without being a global Tour, they have a very rude awakening coming. They've run off all the guys who know what needs to happen, think they have PE money that will solve their problems, but nothing is going to solve their viewership problem when the biggest star is relatively boring, guys like Spieth, JT, and Fowler are irrelevant and the propping up of Max Homa or Joel Dahmen only kind of works if they aren't doing anything at majors to pull in the casual eyeballs. To be clear, I like all of those guys with the exception of JT (sniveling prick) but they just aren't going to pull in the casual fans consistently and they need to those people to hit the contracted viewership numbers for the TV contract. Then, on top of ALL of that, you're going to sponsors trying to get them to pay far more money for a product fewer people are watching and it just isn't sustainable. They have to be a global Tour and they have to work with the PIF. They always had to work with the PIF to be the best product they could be.
It's really not that hard either. You put together a 24 week worldwide Tour plus majors and the playoffs. That's 31 weeks max for the common PGA Tour guy. You can then pull the LIV guys back in, allow them to compete while also leaving room for their 12 or 14 week LIV schedule. You have that top 120ish guys there, with a bunch of churn in the 60-120 range, have the KFT and the ET feed that top tour, get rid of the boat anchor that is the Champions Tour (those guys are collecting ridiculous pension money anyway, **** em) and you can play all over the world. Go take copious amounts of money from Australia and Asia for 2-3 week swings and make your American companies pay more for worldwide viewership on 10-12 events in America. They can then turn these low level events like the Valero or Sanderson into higher level KFT events maybe with increased points.
Sorry. That got way off track.
All that said, LIV absolutely sucks as a product. Just completely soulless golf. The part that really sucks is they've also neutered the PGA Tour (with the help of broadcast partners) to the point where it's not really a watchable product anymore. Combine all that with Tiger essentially being a footnote and providing a week a year to the Tour, and there's a big adjustment coming. If the like of Cantlay, Tiger, et al. belive they're going to find even remotely similar money for the PGA Tour without being a global Tour, they have a very rude awakening coming. They've run off all the guys who know what needs to happen, think they have PE money that will solve their problems, but nothing is going to solve their viewership problem when the biggest star is relatively boring, guys like Spieth, JT, and Fowler are irrelevant and the propping up of Max Homa or Joel Dahmen only kind of works if they aren't doing anything at majors to pull in the casual eyeballs. To be clear, I like all of those guys with the exception of JT (sniveling prick) but they just aren't going to pull in the casual fans consistently and they need to those people to hit the contracted viewership numbers for the TV contract. Then, on top of ALL of that, you're going to sponsors trying to get them to pay far more money for a product fewer people are watching and it just isn't sustainable. They have to be a global Tour and they have to work with the PIF. They always had to work with the PIF to be the best product they could be.
It's really not that hard either. You put together a 24 week worldwide Tour plus majors and the playoffs. That's 31 weeks max for the common PGA Tour guy. You can then pull the LIV guys back in, allow them to compete while also leaving room for their 12 or 14 week LIV schedule. You have that top 120ish guys there, with a bunch of churn in the 60-120 range, have the KFT and the ET feed that top tour, get rid of the boat anchor that is the Champions Tour (those guys are collecting ridiculous pension money anyway, **** em) and you can play all over the world. Go take copious amounts of money from Australia and Asia for 2-3 week swings and make your American companies pay more for worldwide viewership on 10-12 events in America. They can then turn these low level events like the Valero or Sanderson into higher level KFT events maybe with increased points.
Sorry. That got way off track.
Bryson used to be a generational **** to pretty much everyone. I'd love to believe what we saw this week and at Valhalla is a real, changed guy, but I'm a bit skeptical.
I will say I think LIV is a much better ecosystem for Bryson. He's not under the microscope, he can do his side stuff and I do think it's relaxed him quite a bit. I also think he's become a much better thinker on the course. It also doesn't really matter because golf is certainly more interesting with him relevant no matter which guy he is.
Yep, allow everyone to compete everywhere, and make sure only minor tournaments are up against scheduled LIV events.
This is dead on. I don't think LIV ever gains the traction they expected to gain, and I don't think the PGA recovers due to what you said before. Some kind of commonality has to be found, because the public obviously still wants to follow highly competitive golf, but the only time we get that is at the majors. The demand is there, but neither tour is able to supply it.
You guys don’t understand what I’m saying. LIV is contract golf. The PGA is not. That makes LIV basically non-competitive. Bryson has virtually no incentive to play well on the LIV Tour…. he already got his money…. playing well doesn’t really do anything for him.
On the PGA…. for a lot of the players, if they don’t play well, they barely get by. All the incentive is to play well and compete.
I'd like to see what the LIV format could do with a real TV partner that invests in it. The PGA not allowing their TV partners to even talk to LIV basically doomed them from the start.
********. Anyone with status is guaranteed 500K. 139 guys made over $1,000,000 last year. 92 have made that this year.
The KFT guys are the ones getting screwed if you believe anyone is getting screwed. Well, those guys and they guys who qualify for certain status but don't get in because there are guys with absolutely ridiculous exemptions.
Is the demand there in the way they like to think it is? Until Tiger Woods, professional golf was a niche product. He got you off the ground but there hasn't been anyone even approaching the draw that he was and still is if he plays well ever again, which he likely isn't going to. Is the LIV thing just a convenient cover for the Tiger bubble popping? Recreational golf has arguably never been in a better spot. Equipment companies are booming, golf courses are full, and people are playing the game all while the professional game is struggling for viewers. I used to really struggle with the play vs watch dilemma on the weekends but outside the majors, it's not even a thought. Hell, a lot of times I'd rather watch the LPGA play a game where the numbers make sense to me.
A side note- If you miss a cut and Tiger makes it you should be suspended for 6 weeks. Majors and all. Go work on your game.
While true about the PGA tour, nobody watches golf to watch those guys grinding to get by. They watch for the stars who have already made it.
YouTube golf allowed Bryson to completely change his image. He plays competitive matches with well-known amateurs like Grant Horvat but also does fun challenges like playing with junior clubs or $100 clubs from Walmart. The younger generations love it and it's showing when he's on the big stage.
There's about 0% chance you'll ever see that from Scheffler, JT, Spieth, etc.
There's about 0% chance you'll ever see that from Scheffler, JT, Spieth, etc.
Not true. TV ratings are largely determined by what network they're on. Games on ABC, CBS, Fox always outdraw ESPN2, CBSSN, FS1, and it's not because those games are always better.
He was definitely a man of the people last weekend. Saw some clips of him taking the trophy through the crowd after it was over.
To an extent, but if people wanted to watch LIV, they could find it. They don't want to watch.
I wouldn't want to do that stuff either. The difference is I would expect to be less popular and make less money than the guys who do. The large problem with the Tour, and it extends to things beyond tournament payouts, is it's made up of a bunch of guys who think because they are good at golf they should make X amount of dollars. That's just not reality. Cantlay, for instance, is pissed about the PIP program. Tough ****, man, you're boring as **** and not likeable. There is not a single aspect of your personality or game that's at all interesting to anyone so you get to make a lot of money because you're very good but Max if going to get more PIP because he engages with fans and isn't generally an arrogant bore.
Also, why in the hell are the golfers making some of these decisions. Imagine the NFL giving Travis Kelce and Christian McCaffery votes on the next TV contract.
