I think Bates biggest chance to prove himself will be against Iowa. Iowa has not done well in recent years against a spread offense - it's a between the tackels defense. Essentially every Big 12 team will be strong between the tackles - it's the guy that can get outside and thrown on the run that IMO will ultimately get the starting nod. That's the offense coach wants to run, and I simply think the physical attributes PB brings to the table are better suited for that kind of offense. He just has to show that he can remain poised, make good decisions, and lead the team.
Bates vs Arnaud
- Thread starter Bobber
- Start date
I am a fan of picking the starting QB sooner than later. Duel QB for longer than 2 games just reminds me of Austen Flynn and Bret Myer. That battle lasted too long, and I remember all kinds of comments on message boards that having a duel QB system is bad for the offense because each QB has their own style. People said the offense needs the luxury of only having to learn one style and not having to adjust when the QB is switched up in the middle of the game. I don't know if I agree with this logic or not, butthat was the arguement against it at the time.
Going off of the SDSU performance, I think it is clearly AA's job to lose and PB would need to pull a Seneca-like performance for him to win the job without AA tanking.
People saying PB will be starting in a couple weeks either know something I don't or they are in the Hawkeye mentality that "Gene isn't seeing PB's potential" and that is why he's riding pine. I'm impartial to who wins but I trust the coaches and won't be questioning any less-than-perfect play that the starter makes.
Also, I really hope that is not true about PB packing bags if he doesn't get the job. I will reserve judgment, but that would simply be a case of addition by subtraction for the team if it were true.
People saying PB will be starting in a couple weeks either know something I don't or they are in the Hawkeye mentality that "Gene isn't seeing PB's potential" and that is why he's riding pine. I'm impartial to who wins but I trust the coaches and won't be questioning any less-than-perfect play that the starter makes.
Also, I really hope that is not true about PB packing bags if he doesn't get the job. I will reserve judgment, but that would simply be a case of addition by subtraction for the team if it were true.
I found it hard to compare the two QBs because we seemed to be using different playbooks depending on who was in the game. Arnaud would hand the ball off and throw short passes, while Bates ran a lot of options and threw an occasional pass.
Arnaud's passes all looked quick and accurate. Bates threw 2 that I did not think were well placed, but I'm not sure he had enough opportunity to throw it. Bates ran the ball very well, but Arnaud never had the opportunity to try as he always got rid of the ball on time and did not have designed runs called for him. Arnaud certainly appeared mobile last year though and I'm far from convinced that he could not also capably run the option.
The kicker I suppose is that the staff has the opportunity to evaluate both QBs in practice and has hopefully compared the two on more equal terms.
Arnaud's passes all looked quick and accurate. Bates threw 2 that I did not think were well placed, but I'm not sure he had enough opportunity to throw it. Bates ran the ball very well, but Arnaud never had the opportunity to try as he always got rid of the ball on time and did not have designed runs called for him. Arnaud certainly appeared mobile last year though and I'm far from convinced that he could not also capably run the option.
The kicker I suppose is that the staff has the opportunity to evaluate both QBs in practice and has hopefully compared the two on more equal terms.
Great point. I agree. Arnaud never really had a chance to run. More of Bates plays seemed to be run by design. Watching them both play in another game or two will tell the tale. I think we'll have one in place maybe by the UNLV game.
I was at the game and thought both players managed the offense very well getting us into the endzone. The OL did a good job to of keeping pressure off of the qb's. Right now though my arms are up into the air as to who will be the main QB I think both are athletic, but Bates has quicker feet other than that time will only tell. Whoever gets the call should be thankful in winning one hell of a battle, but the other should not be disapointed. I am thankful in having two really good QB's, in my eyes it is a win win situation. Whoever the coaches pick I will definitely be backing them on their decision. Anyway lets get another win Cyclones it is payback time for Kent State!!!!!!!
The 2 quarterback system has worked at ISU before, Hardeman/Stanley and the one I remember best.....yes, I am old(er).....Amundson/Carlson. But with Amundson and Carlson, Amundson was a great tailback, so he played each and every down and was only the back-up quarterback. The next year after Carlson graduated, Amundson took over and was an All-American at quarterback. Then he went on to a couple of years in the NFL as a running back.
I think Arnaud is your quarterback for now. But, I also think you need to get Bates on the field in some capacity...some "special" plays that can make the defenses nervous when they see them both on the field. I am sure Chizik and staff have a few of those in mind. (You think Iowa won't notice and adjust this year if Bates lines up as a wide-out again?......lol)
What I saw was a confident leader in Arnaud for someone starting their first game. And what I saw in Bates was a very exciting player, a better runner, and maybe just a little bit of a "loose cannon" in his first action at quarterback.
It will be interesting to see how Chizik utilizes both players. Whatever the case, it's not a bad problem to have. You have a good quarterback, and what appears to be a more than competent back-up. A lot of teams don't have either, let alone both. Plus they are both only sophomores.
Sometimes competitions like this, if there is one, can be a really good thing I think. Kind of keeps both players performing at their best. At least we can hope for that, right?
I think Arnaud is your quarterback for now. But, I also think you need to get Bates on the field in some capacity...some "special" plays that can make the defenses nervous when they see them both on the field. I am sure Chizik and staff have a few of those in mind. (You think Iowa won't notice and adjust this year if Bates lines up as a wide-out again?......lol)
What I saw was a confident leader in Arnaud for someone starting their first game. And what I saw in Bates was a very exciting player, a better runner, and maybe just a little bit of a "loose cannon" in his first action at quarterback.
It will be interesting to see how Chizik utilizes both players. Whatever the case, it's not a bad problem to have. You have a good quarterback, and what appears to be a more than competent back-up. A lot of teams don't have either, let alone both. Plus they are both only sophomores.
Sometimes competitions like this, if there is one, can be a really good thing I think. Kind of keeps both players performing at their best. At least we can hope for that, right?
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You're right on the mark, if you don't mind me saying so. Depth. Gotta have it.
Seems to me that player participation is one of the key differences we see between McCarney's and Chizik's approaches to the game.
We all know DannyMac did not substitute much, (which drove some of us nuts). A number of us believe lack of depth -- the fatigue factor -- had something to do with going 7-4 in 2005 rather than 10-1 (or, imaginably, even 11-0). The lack of depth and late-game conservative strategy, I'd guess most fans would point to.
This youthful ISU team is in a rebuilding stage of development, but the staff played tons of guys Thursday night. As if to kind of force player development, maybe?
Anyway, the staff seems hellbent on building depth at whatever the cost. I love it.
It's still really too early to tell. Yes, each made a case, (either for or against themselves) but I want to see more from each before passing judgement. Neither had a drive where they had to punt nor an interception. Overall AA had a better round one simply for the fact that he didn't turn the ball over.
As for Arnaud, I want to see how well he can run. Chizik expects rushing production from our QB. Also, I want to see if he's developed any touch on deeper balls. Say what you want about Meyer, but that was an area where he really shined. AA's got to be able to throw more than just ropes.
As for Bates, we saw glimpses of what he's capable of but not enough to really make the case for him. One intangible he has is that if he decides to start running, it freezes the linebackers and the corners, which will make the receivers more open. It may mean that he doesn't have to be as good of a passer as AA to be as good of a QB.
The bottom line is that Bates is probably also the best running back on the team. Regardless of where he is in the QB battle, they should make every effort to get him into the game for 90% of the offensive snaps. That is way too much talent to leave on the sidelines.
As for Arnaud, I want to see how well he can run. Chizik expects rushing production from our QB. Also, I want to see if he's developed any touch on deeper balls. Say what you want about Meyer, but that was an area where he really shined. AA's got to be able to throw more than just ropes.
As for Bates, we saw glimpses of what he's capable of but not enough to really make the case for him. One intangible he has is that if he decides to start running, it freezes the linebackers and the corners, which will make the receivers more open. It may mean that he doesn't have to be as good of a passer as AA to be as good of a QB.
The bottom line is that Bates is probably also the best running back on the team. Regardless of where he is in the QB battle, they should make every effort to get him into the game for 90% of the offensive snaps. That is way too much talent to leave on the sidelines.
Good post. I would be shocked if the staff locks in on one QB at this stage in the season based on fall camp and one game. Chizik wants true competition at all positions. He is on record as stating that some backups for game 1 could very well be starting by the end of the year.
The job is AA's until he does something to loose it. GC has stated several times that he is looking for the guy that can manage the offense and not make a lot of mistakes. He is not looking for the guy that tries to do too much. AA is the management guy, PB is the big play guy. Just remember there are two types of big play, good and bad. If AA gets to the point where he is unable to manage the offense and score points, PB will get the starts.
