Big 12 Conference Realignment

[AuH2O]

What you keep describing in all of these threads...is a surefire way to tear a conference apart. There is a reason that there has been so many problems in the Big 12...and it is precisely because a few schools were and/or have been treated differently than the others. Those schools have made more, received more and had more power in the conference and has caused nothing but division and angst in the conference.

Almost all of the defectors from the Big 12 have listed the lack of equal distribution and power as the main reason for wanting out.

And ISU has gotten the short end of the stick since the beginning... and you want that to start over again, just when we finally get everyone on equal ground? Think about what you are talking about and what that does to a conference.

I’d say significant unequal distribution is kind of moot in the current conference environment, or at least if the PAC loses a bunch of teams.

At that point the options are to be in the Big 12 or Big 10/SEC. The money difference is such that if one of the latter wants you, you’re going, and there isn’t a level of feasible unequal distribution that’s going to change that. If the Big 10 or SEC don’t send you an invite, you have no leverage to push for unequal distribution.

Maybe you offer full share from year 1 to say UW with an out for a Big 10 invite. Maybe the four corners get reduced share for a while. But ultimately when it stabilizes there really isnt a reason for uneven distribution. It will not be probable to do it in a way that keeps teams in the league over the P2 options, so why bother?

 

[goody2012]

The moment you have unequal revenue share you create a conference that isn’t made up of equals. It’s one thing to have new conference members take a reduced rate for a few years. It’s another thing to have unequal revenue built into a conference. While money has a limiting effect towards on field performance, off the field it has a big one. It would also be impossible to balance. Do you rate viewership higher than standing? How do you factor in non revenue sports? It’s a giant mess that no conference should ever willingly venture into.

Also it feels weird saying all this on a Big12 board where most people complain (rightfully so) about the outsize influence of Texas.

You also create a stable conference because the ones actually driving the revenue are rewarded for it.

 

[2speedy1]

Go to The Athletic and read an article from Nicole Auerbach dated Nov 16, 2022.

Link?

Maybe you dont know how to post them?

 

[Kentuckyclone]

Link?

Maybe you dont know how to post them?

 

[NILversusCFL]

Life in the Big 12 will be tougher in the future with the addition of the 4 and OU / UT leaving. The 4 new teams all have something that Oklahoma and Texas always had a shortage of.

 

[BCClone]

I just see things differently than you. And my impression is most schools left the Big12 for cultural (CU) or financial reasons. I believe a conference can be cohesive even if some schools make more money off the media rights/playoff contracts.

I am a firm believer that when the new 12 team CFB Playoff goes out to open bid and $2B starts floating around college sports, we will see the "haves" take more. Do you really think Ohio State, Alabama, Georgia, Clemson or any playoff team is going to settle for an "equal share"?

And they'll get a lot more than $5M more than their conference counterparts.

That works just as well as having 10 people in an office working on the same stuff, with the same responsibilities and paying 2 of them 25% more than the rest. Others will find out and get mad and then you have a mess.

 

[FriendlySpartan]

You also create a stable conference because the ones actually driving the revenue are rewarded for it.

Ummm you’re a Big12 fan right? How did that conference stability work out so far?

 

[alarson]

You also create a stable conference because the ones actually driving the revenue are rewarded for it.

That's literally the opposite of how it has worked out.

 

[FriendlySpartan]

That's literally the opposite of how it has worked out.

This feels so weird to have to point out multiple times on a Big12 board

 

[Clonedogg]

I just see things differently than you. And my impression is most schools left the Big12 for cultural (CU) or financial reasons. I believe a conference can be cohesive even if some schools make more money off the media rights/playoff contracts.

I am a firm believer that when the new 12 team CFB Playoff goes out to open bid and $2B starts floating around college sports, we will see the "haves" take more. Do you really think Ohio State, Alabama, Georgia, Clemson or any playoff team is going to settle for an "equal share"?

And they'll get a lot more than $5M more than their conference counterparts.

I agree, it could be worth it and talking about options are what the board is for.

Another option is to be only for this contact, 6 yrs, and/or decrease the bonus yearly by 2 percent or whatever

 

[exCyDing]

You also create a stable conference because the ones actually driving the revenue are rewarded for it.

The B12 was the only Power conference that had unequal revenue distribution and it has been the poster child of infighting and instability since its inception. Things are finally starting to stabilize with the last of those who were getting more leaving.

Look, WAOR could demand an outsized share in the PAC because they have the threat of leaving. If they joined the B12, they wouldn't have that threat. If/when they get a B10/SEC invite, there's nothing the B12 could offer to match it. Until then, anywhere they could choose to go would be less than the equal share in the B12.

 

[alarson]

The B12 was the only Power conference that had unequal revenue distribution and it has been the poster child of infighting and instability since its inception. Things are finally starting to stabilize with the last of those who were getting more leaving.

Look, WAOR could demand an outsized share in the PAC because they have the threat of leaving. If they joined the B12, they wouldn't have that threat. If/when they get a B10/SEC invite, there's nothing the B12 could offer to match it. Until then, anywhere they could choose to go would be less than the equal share in the B12.

And lets face it, if they come here its because they dont have that invite, and because they've decided the PAC isn't viable. The big 12 holds the cards. And if schools like AZ\ASU are interested, the big 12 could force the issue by taking them and making the PAC even less viable for OU\WA

 

[isucy86]

That's literally the opposite of how it has worked out.

From a media value or performance on the field?

The value a team brings a conference can fall into either category.

• Texas & OU drove revenue based on their media rights value. That's why they are in the SEC and USC/UCLA are in the Big10.
• Then there is revenue driving by on field/on court performance. OU, TCU and any Big12 that has played in a NY6 Bowl has contributed in that respect. Same goes for NCAA Tournament teams, but to a lesser extent.

I want Oregon & Washington in the Big12, because I feel the Big12 would be worth more to its media rights holders (ESPN & FOX). And if they join the Big12, Iowa State and all Big12 teams will benefit financially from higher media rights.

When the CFB Playoff expands to 12 AND media rights go out to the open market, it may be more important than ever to have multiple teams in the playoff. Especially if the CFB Playoff dollars are only distributed to conferences with teams in the playoff and the distribution is based on # of teams and how far they advance. Going to a Units concept would be consistent with what happens with the NCAA Hoops Tournament media rights. I'd rather the Big12 be included in the split of billions instead of shutout or receive a token payment.

I don't care if the Big10 wants Oregon/Washington right now or 5 years from now, the Big12 should want them and be aggressive about bringing them onboard. I like both school's football traditions and where they sit today with Lanning and DeBoer. I am all about the Big12 closing the gap between our conference and the Big10/SEC by 2030. If additions can achieve that, I am all for it.

Why else are we looking to bring in Gonzaga? We are counting on them being an NCAA Tournament team and when the Hoops Media Rights go out to bid in 2032ish, Yormark wants to cash in. IMO we can be timid or be aggressive over the next 6 years. If your concerned about Washington or Oregon making a few million more than ISU- that's not being aggressive and maybe costing the Big12 hundreds of millions annually.

 

[isucy86]

That works just as well as having 10 people in an office working on the same stuff, with the same responsibilities and paying 2 of them 25% more than the rest. Others will find out and get mad and then you have a mess.

What about in Sales?

Does the salesperson who brings in the most money settle for the same amount as the person who can't sell a lick and just gets their draw?

In my experience those 10 people in the office are far more appreciative and supportive of the sales person kicking butt and ensuring they get a paycheck every other week.

Even the average salesperson knows the score. In companies I've worked for the average salesperson looks up to and attempts to learn from a great salesperson. They aren't mad if the great salesperson makes more and sometimes a ton more!

Transparency is important. If the Big12 and its media consultant presents the President & AD's with information that ESPN/Fox, etc. are willing to enhance the Big12's media deal if Oregon/Washington & any other Pac12 teams are added, why would an AD be mad? It Yormark's job to manage the egos.

 

[alarson]

From a media value or performance on the field?

The value a team brings a conference can fall into either category.

• Texas & OU drove revenue based on their media rights value. That's why they are in the SEC and USC/UCLA are in the Big10.
• Then there is revenue driving by on field/on court performance. OU, TCU and any Big12 that has played in a NY6 Bowl has contributed in that respect. Same goes for NCAA Tournament teams, but to a lesser extent.

I want Oregon & Washington in the Big12, because I feel the Big12 would be worth more to its media rights holders (ESPN & FOX). And if they join the Big12, Iowa State and all Big12 teams will benefit financially from higher media rights.

When the CFB Playoff expands to 12 AND media rights go out to the open market, it may be more important than ever to have multiple teams in the playoff. Especially if the CFB Playoff dollars are only distributed to conferences with teams in the playoff and the distribution is based on # of teams and how far they advance. Going to a Units concept would be consistent with what happens with the NCAA Hoops Tournament media rights. I'd rather the Big12 be included in the split of billions instead of shutout or receive a token payment.

I don't care if the Big10 wants Oregon/Washington right now or 5 years from now, the Big12 should want them and be aggressive about bringing them onboard. I like both school's football traditions and where they sit today with Lanning and DeBoer. I am all about the Big12 closing the gap between our conference and the Big10/SEC by 2030. If additions can achieve that, I am all for it.

Why else are we looking to bring in Gonzaga? We are counting on them being an NCAA Tournament team and when the Hoops Media Rights go out to bid in 2032ish, Yormark wants to cash in. IMO we can be timid or be aggressive over the next 6 years. If your concerned about Washington or Oregon making a few million more than ISU- that's not being aggressive and maybe costing the Big12 hundreds of millions annually.

Unequal revenue brings instability, not stability. Weve seen this multiple times now.

And you are massively overstating the value of Oregon\Washington anyway. They are regional draws at best, with Oregon likely to drop off hard once Knight dies. Definitely not worth the destabilizing factors inequality brings.

 

[FriendlySpartan]

From a media value or performance on the field?

The value a team brings a conference can fall into either category.

• Texas & OU drove revenue based on their media rights value. That's why they are in the SEC and USC/UCLA are in the Big10.
• Then there is revenue driving by on field/on court performance. OU, TCU and any Big12 that has played in a NY6 Bowl has contributed in that respect. Same goes for NCAA Tournament teams, but to a lesser extent.

I want Oregon & Washington in the Big12, because I feel the Big12 would be worth more to its media rights holders (ESPN & FOX). And if they join the Big12, Iowa State and all Big12 teams will benefit financially from higher media rights.

When the CFB Playoff expands to 12 AND media rights go out to the open market, it may be more important than ever to have multiple teams in the playoff. Especially if the CFB Playoff dollars are only distributed to conferences with teams in the playoff and the distribution is based on # of teams and how far they advance. Going to a Units concept would be consistent with what happens with the NCAA Hoops Tournament media rights. I'd rather the Big12 be included in the split of billions instead of shutout or receive a token payment.

I don't care if the Big10 wants Oregon/Washington right now or 5 years from now, the Big12 should want them and be aggressive about bringing them onboard. I like both school's football traditions and where they sit today with Lanning and DeBoer. I am all about the Big12 closing the gap between our conference and the Big10/SEC by 2030. If additions can achieve that, I am all for it.

Why else are we looking to bring in Gonzaga? We are counting on them being an NCAA Tournament team and when the Hoops Media Rights go out to bid in 2032ish, Yormark wants to cash in. IMO we can be timid or be aggressive over the next 6 years. If your concerned about Washington or Oregon making a few million more than ISU- that's not being aggressive and maybe costing the Big12 hundreds of millions annually.

You’re looking to bring in Gonzaga because it costs you essentially nothing. Basketball money is a rounding error.

In what world is not adding UW and OU going to cost the Big12 “hundreds of millions annually”? You realize if they could command that kind of cash they would either A. Be in the big ten already. Or B Have the pac in a much better position.

The simple fact that you have watched the Big12 lose a half dozen members, be put on life support due to issues stemming from power/financial imbalance, and still don’t realize how bad unequal revenue sharing is is baffling.

 

[BCClone]

What about in Sales?

Does the salesperson who brings in the most money settle for the same amount as the person who can't sell a lick and just gets their draw?

In my experience those 10 people in the office are far more appreciative and supportive of the sales person kicking butt and ensuring they get a paycheck every other week.

Even the average salesperson knows the score. In companies I've worked for the average salesperson looks up to and attempts to learn from a great salesperson. They aren't mad if the great salesperson makes more and sometimes a ton more!

Transparency is important. If the Big12 and its media consultant presents the President & AD's with information that ESPN/Fox, etc. are willing to enhance the Big12's media deal if Oregon/Washington & any other Pac12 teams are added, why would an AD be mad? It Yormark's job to manage the egos.

Sales is commission basically anytime I was in it. You stood alone on your own merits. So you are in favor of each team selling their own tier ones, twos and threes?

 

[KnappShack]

Sales is commission basically anytime I was in it. You stood alone on your own merits. So you are in favor of each team selling their own tier ones, twos and threes?

Seeing how JP said we were in the have-nots of the have-nots....

I'm not sure Mediacom would cover the $31 mil

 

[BCClone]

Seeing how JP said we were in the have-nots of the have-nots....

I'm not sure Mediacom would cover the $31 mil

We are the janitors right now, head janitor probably. Hoping we make our way to the maintenance department soon. Maybe low management if CMC gets the train turned around.

 

[Cyforce]

This does not sound like a good deal for the Big 12. Washington is not in a position with the upper hand.

My guess it would basically be a stiffen for travel expenses.