Here comes the doomsday thread, sorry

[FriendlySpartan]

It takes the best coaches and when they start paying players it will make it nearly impossible for the Big 12 to compete talent wise.

Well the best best coaches were already being taken by those teams, this isn’t anything new despite the increase in media rights deals.

If schools can start paying players all college sports will become extinct very quickly because that would make them employees and that is chaos on another level.

 

[FriendlySpartan]

This is purely speculation on my part but what foresee with the revenue sharing inevitably coming. The top recruits have always been getting a bag that is no secret but I will use an example.

Say you have a 3-4 star player whose offer list is Iowa state, Kansas, KSU, Iowa, Wisconsin, Minnesota. I would imagine majority of the time type of recruit wasn’t getting induced by money to a school. Now with revenue sharing that recruit will get FAR more money going to any of the big 10 schools than the big 12 schools. That’s where the talent gap will widen, in my opinion.

If you go with that revenue sharing model you could be correct but then we get into employee territory that gets very messy. Also would depend largely on how that revenue is calculated and distributed considering that very revenue is what props up all the other sports. Plus you get into title 9 issues. That’s a model that is going to face a lot of opposition but if you’re correct would have a potential impact.

 

[BWRhasnoAC]

Well the best best coaches were already being taken by those teams, this isn’t anything new despite the increase in media rights deals.

If schools can start paying players all college sports will become extinct very quickly because that would make them employees and that is chaos on another level.

It's coming.

 

[HFCS]

Hahaha no it’s not, and again these are institutions of higher learning not for profit businesses. Comparing them to mega churches is pure emotions talking.

Again your reading comprehension is lacking because I didn’t say anything about research or academic prestige or anything of the sorts. You keep trying to put words in my mouth that I didn’t say.

So to explain, you said businesses can always be counted on for short term profit over long term stability/outlook. I said they aren’t businesses they are institutions of higher learning and aren’t focused on profit. Then you spend the next several posts making comments about completely unrelated things that I never said in reference to my higher learning response.

Hope that cleared it up, if you want to keep going try to quote what I actually said instead of inferring or infusing your own thoughts into my statements.

I just think it's nonsensical this "brothership of institutions of higher learning" roundly rejected two institutions of far greater stature than any of them while getting excited about Oregon and Nebraska at the same time.

You're deluding yourself they aren't interested in maximizing the money coming in, and in that respect they're like anyone else, they want the money NOW. The profit is different than a publicly traded corperation, but it's there. It's incredibly analogous to a megachurch in that way. Sometimes it's analogous to a megachurch in the way members rally around a horrible scandal rather than take responsibility too but not always.

 

[FriendlySpartan]

I just think it's nonsensical this "brothership of institutions of higher learning" roundly rejected two institutions of far greater stature than any of them while getting excited about Oregon and Nebraska at the same time.

You're deluding yourself they aren't interested in maximizing the money coming in, and in that respect they're like anyone else, they want the money NOW. The profit is different than a publicly traded corperation, but it's there. It's incredibly analogous to a megachurch in that way. Sometimes it's analogous to a megachurch in the way members rally around a horrible scandal rather than take responsibility too but not always.

They really aren’t though. These institutions have been around for longer than 99.9% of all business that exist in the US today. They aren’t short sighted and are always looking towards the future. So again, not focused on short term profit because they have no investors, shareholders, or any type of profit sharing for that money to go to.

 

[Mr Janny]

FA: Cut a huge chunk of traditional power conference programs out of the club

FO: None of those fans are interested in transferring their university degrees, ratings, or fandom to the next closest blue-blood school

Is that really a worry for the blue bloods, though?
The SEC and Big10 have certainly done their due diligence and forecasting on possible outcomes if they become the power 2. It's not like they're going to make the decision and then say "Oh man, we didn't even consider that some fans of other schools won't watch our product!". That's not how this works, and if they felt there was a significant risk that they would end up in a situation where they would be making less money, you can bet they wouldn't make the move.
If they end up going power 2 it's because they are damned sure that they don't need us.

 

[simply1]

They really aren’t though. These institutions have been around for longer than 99.9% of all business that exist in the US today. They aren’t short sighted and are always looking towards the future. So again, not focused on short term profit because they have no investors, shareholders, or any type of profit sharing for that money to go to.

Athletic Departments are absolutely in competition with each other and operate similarly to businesses. It’s why they separate them from the university as much as possible with salaries and such.

 

[HFCS]

They really aren’t though. These institutions have been around for longer than 99.9% of all business that exist in the US today. They aren’t short sighted and are always looking towards the future. So again, not focused on short term profit because they have no investors, shareholders, or any type of profit sharing for that money to go to.

I agree the non profit status of these giant ADs and megachurches does give them stability advantages that a corporation with quarterly reports and share holders does not get. If you're only saying that then we agreed all along. $$$ is driving all of this, if it wasn't they wouldn't have left Stanford and Cal out.

 

[FriendlySpartan]

I agree the non profit status of these giant ADs and megachurches does give them stability advantages that a corporation with quarterly reports and share holders does not get. If you're only saying that then we agreed all along. $$$ is driving all of this, if it wasn't they wouldn't have left Stanford and Cal out.

My original argument was against you saying short term profit trumps everything because that’s not how these schools operate. You were making this point comparing them to business which I disagreed with because their fundamental goal isn’t to make money. If it was they wouldn’t be carrying 90% of the sports they do.

Btw cal and Stanford weren’t left out of anything as they are currently in the P4 with the same opportunities as anyone else, so that point kinda falls flat.

 

[HFCS]

My original argument was against you saying short term profit trumps everything because that’s not how these schools operate. You were making this point comparing them to business which I disagreed with because their fundamental goal isn’t to make money. If it was they wouldn’t be carrying 90% of the sports they do.

Btw cal and Stanford weren’t left out of anything as they are currently in the P4 with the same opportunities as anyone else, so that point kinda falls flat.

I think a fundamental goal of these big ADs is to make money for the program facilities, administrators and coaches. We just disagree. It's why the megachurch comparison as a faux "non-profit" is appropriate.

It might be because of being in a conference with Texas makes this all incredibly clear. Money is at least as important as winning to many of them. In terms of the athletic department and athletic conference affiliation, academic profile is pretty meaningless.

Cal and Stanford most definitely got a demotion, their non revenue sports now have to travel coast to coast constantly (try flying to the east coast when you live on the west coast and lose 3 hours getting there) and it's almost certain the ACC they joined is going to be diminished or even disbanded at some point. It's like if UCLA and USC joined the Big Ten but got almost none of the financial benefit from it and 50% chance they have to join the American or drop football in a few years.

 

[FriendlySpartan]

I think a fundamental goal of these big ADs is to make money for the program facilities, administrators and coaches. We just disagree. It's why the megachurch comparison as a faux "non-profit" is appropriate.

It might be because of being in a conference with Texas makes this all incredibly clear. Money is at least as important as winning to many of them. In terms of the athletic department and athletic conference affiliation, academic profile is pretty meaningless.

Cal and Stanford most definitely got a demotion, their non revenue sports now have to travel coast to coast constantly (try flying to the east coast when you live on the west coast and lose 3 hours getting there) and it's almost certain the ACC they joined is going to be diminished or even disbanded at some point. It's like if UCLA and USC joined the Big Ten but got almost none of the financial benefit from it and 50% chance they have to join the American or drop football in a few years.

Those are all fair points, especially with the travel. Even Washington and Oregon didn’t get the money bump though when they joined the big ten so will be interesting to see how that plays out.

 

[byebye]

But all of that has happened without the intentional disenfranchisement of millions of fans.

I’m talking about those leagues saying “we’re having our own party and none of you can come”.

That move would 100% lower ratings and revenue.

The more casual fan will welcome this as NFL-lite - "employees" or not, they will still enjoy the perception of amatuerism, it will still be "college" football - & over night, their value will skyrocket & the value of other leagues will plummet - the more serious fans (like yourself) are saying now that they won't watch, but most of them probably still will - ratings will increase b/c it will be the only thing on (ESPN & FOX) b/c half the country or more don't have CBS Sports Network or Peacock (where the Cyclones will be broadcast) - they don't care if you watch, b/c they're going to shove it down everyone else's throats

 

[NWICY]

Summary we are the haves, the rest of you can dissolve your athletic departments.

 

[NWICY]

Maybe but I doubt it. I’d still watch because I love football and there are some great teams to watch in that bucket. Despite all the changes and outcry over NIL, viewership shows signs of increasing on the horizon, just like they have for big NFL games this year.

Meh, I don't even have a diehard pro team, when the SECB1G merge to make their super conference I might watch what ever playoff championship they have but that will be it.

 

[isucy86]

They really aren’t though. These institutions have been around for longer than 99.9% of all business that exist in the US today. They aren’t short sighted and are always looking towards the future. So again, not focused on short term profit because they have no investors, shareholders, or any type of profit sharing for that money to go to.

They have been around 150 years because educationally they don't have much competition (high % of students are in-state and even greater % going back 25+ years) as education has been highly regulated and state controlled.

I would say college athletics is more short sited than ever with NIL and transfer rules- it's all about how do I win this year! At the power 4/5 level coaches no longer have 3+ years to build winning programs.

 

[Nor'MidWester]

It just frustrates me to no end that everyone thinks the way college athletics is headed is bad yet supposedly no one can do anything to stop it. We all just roll over when the powers that be move forward with this. They'll say they're doing this in the interest of the players, paying them what they deserve but really they're just consolidating power into 30 teams so the mega rich can get mega richer.

 

[FriendlySpartan]

They have been around 150 years because educationally they don't have much competition (high % of students are in-state and even greater % going back 25+ years) as education has been highly regulated and state controlled.

I would say college athletics is more short sited than ever with NIL and transfer rules- it's all about how do I win this year! At the power 4/5 level coaches no longer have 3+ years to build winning programs.

That’s the main point of this group, to reign in and put some actual enforceable rules in place for NIL and transfers.

 

[CascadeClone]

I have seen nothing to change my mind that what will happen is a super league. The 20ish blue bloods will ascend, and have tons of money, antitrust, pay players, et al. The schools may license off the rights to the teams to avoid entanglements and ugliness. Because thats what TV geniuses want, and theynwrite the checks. Nobody who gets invited is going to pass on the big money, money is undefeated.

The rest will be more like the traditional college football, with a new version of the ncaa in charge. And yes, the SEC and B1G teams that don't rapture out will be part of that. And thats what i will be watching.

 

[isucy86]

That’s the main point of this group, to reign in and put some actual enforceable rules in place for NIL and transfers.

Unfortunately, the toothpaste is out of the tube. Anything short of employee status is probably a waste of time.

 

[FriendlySpartan]

Unfortunately, the toothpaste is out of the tube. Anything short of employee status is probably a waste of time.

If you go employee status say good bye to 90% or more of all college sports. People can complain all they want about NIL and transfers which really has changed very little but employee status will destroy college sports