*** Official The Dark Knight Rises Thread***
- Thread starter isuska
- Start date
Thought Bane was such a ruthless villain, and Hardy was the perfect actor to play him, too.
If Hollywood does another reboot of the Bat franchise down the road, I don't think there's any way they find such a great collection of actors to do it.
My expectations were pretty low, actually. Not like wanting it to be bad or anything low, but i understood that one of the major factors that mad TDK so great was Heath Ledger's performance as Joker, and as much faith as I have in Tom Hardy, JGL, and Anne Hathaway, the sort of performance we got out of Ledger isn't something that duplicates easily.
I walked into it expecting it to be the Return of the Jedi of the Batman Trilogy. I walked in with the exact same level of expectation on DKR as I did on Amazing Spiderman. Both movies surprised me, just in different directions.
I have some very specific reasons I didn't like this movie, but I'm unwilling to post spoilers, so I'll be as general as possible (though if you're worried about spoilers to an excessive degree, I'd still avoid what I'm about to write). I'll start with what I liked, then move into what I didn't.
I loved Anne Hathaway as Catwoman. I can see why she and Nolan are considering doing a movie together about the character. I especially liked how frequently the name "catwoman" was used (read: never). She was, however, completely superfluous to this story/plot. I mean, top to bottom, she wasn't necessary to the movie.
I actually quite liked Tom Hardy as Bane. Every scene he was in (up until his last one... and I mean, the last 2 seconds of his screen time) was just power in-presence. He commanded every scene he was in, dominated every situation. He was, as someone has pointed out, a boulder pointed down hill, and no matter where you run, he was rolling right at you
Joseph Gordon-Levit stole the movie for me, though. He was an amazing character as John Blake, and brought everything to the role that I could have hoped for. I could have watched a John Blake movie for three hours. I felt like, in addition to JGL being great, the character represented what Bruce wanted from the beginning. We spent all of TDK talking about Harvey Dent as the "White Knight Gotham needed" because he could do what he was doing without a mask, and then in DKR, we get Blake, who is essentially Bruce without money. And without the need to wear a mask. He, at one point, even scoffed at the idea of wearing a mask. He was what Batman was supposed to cause. He was the "win" for Batman. Which is why the last scene and what it implied really really disappointed me.
So, that's what I liked.
What I didn't like...
Nolan is great for symbolism. Symbols and standins are one of his strengths. But in this movie, he really just used the symbols and flipped us off with a "it's a symbol, jack hole, don't ask questions."
The prison had no context, no location, no timeline. Characters showed up there (wherever there was supposed to be) between scenes of them doing time-sensitive things in Gotham. I've read someone saying "as a medical professional, the scene with the spine made me laugh." I reject that. I am not a medical professional, and it was still ridiculous.
The big twist in the ending, despite being broadcast from the first 10 minutes of the film, (and I can't make this point without minor spoilers, so if you're still reading, don't...) left a great villain for the movie as a lackey in the service of someone who had literally less than 5 minutes of screen time/development. And 5 minutes later, that lackey was killed without a second glance by a camera, to facilitate a quip by Catwoman.
I disliked the fact that we were watching a movie about a Bruce Wayne who was just a tough guy in a cape with money, rather than a detective or, you know, even above average intelligence. Batman is powerful as a character, not because of his physical attributes, but because of his mental ones. These mental attributes are downplayed significantly, especially in the beginning of the movie. I can't enjoy a batman who'd hang up his cape because his girlfriend (not actually his girlfriend, btw) bit it. I can't enjoy a batman who is only batman because it's all he's got left. Bruce was barely Batman in this film, and when he was, he still wasn't Batman.
I hated the Batwing. I know that we've been sold this bill of goods that this version of Batman is more realistic, grounded in the real world, and all of that rot. And I can buy it, despite it being a stretch. But the minute that Foxx said "turbines without recirculated air" I balked. And it looked silly. And then it was on the screen for more of the movie than Batman himself was (yes, I know we can say that Bruce was in the Batwing every time it flew, but that's not Batman being on the screen). I know it was important to establish the Batwing for the climax of the movie (though, when you have to establish Batman's new gadget in order to fulfill the climax of your movie... for the second time in a row... you're in Bat Shark Repellent territory).
I felt like the plot was a muddled mess, asking us to trust that certain things just happened, and then to forget other things were happening. Once again, spoilers here to an extent. If you read any spoilers, it's really your own dang fault at this point. The sense of time was way off, to the point where during the pivotal 5 months of the film, no one's hair grew; no one grew a beard. One of my friends had to resort to suggesting that 3000 people stopped off at home for a shower and shave before marching on city hall. This, again, goes to our "Screw you, it's symbolism" attitude. The ruling class of the city (Bane's soldiers) are all depicted with scraggly beards and hair, while the refugees who were being given just enough food to survive were all clean shaven.
And then the ending. I wont talk specifics. But the nice little bow wrapped around everything, the happy ending, made me very disappointed. The final scene with Blake made me dislike Bruce even more.
I left disappointed.
I walked in saying "as long as this is better than Green Lantern, I'll be happy." I guess, by that definition, I was happy with it. It was far from the worst comic movie that's come out in the last few years, but it was only the third best to come out this summer.
The scene where Batman and Blake talk about the reason and meaning for a mask I saw it differently. Blake said I am not afraid of these people so I don't need a mask, but Batman explained, its not the fear of what people can do to you, it is what these people can do to people close to you. That is why you wear the mask. Like in Batman Begins where Falcone says, "people around you have so much to lose."
I don't understand the issue with the symbols you have.
The prison sequence was a little sudden, but it is supposed to have no location. It is a place where people do not know of its existence, but they have heard of it. They don't know where it is, but they never want to be there if given the choice. "bane has a line that says I believe, "You feed them hope until their end" or something like that. So the prison and Gotham are one and the same.
I do agree with the twist. I was surprised by it, but I also got caught up in the movie and didn't get hints of the twist in the beginning. They could have done that better.
I liked the fact that they showed that batman is human. When you see him, you feel he is superhuman, but in reality, he is just a really smart guy with lots of money, but he still has the same frailties as everyone else. He falls just like everyone, but he learns to pick himself back up.
The Batwing I thought was cool. I don't anything about air technology or anything so I just went with the flow on that one.
PLot was a little muddled, but I think it all came together nicely. I really could care les if the refugees had grown beards or not. I know they were given supplie throughout their ordeal, maybe they had razors as well?
And with the ending, what did you want to happen?
I respect your opinion and the points you bring up are good points. There are areas I wish could have been improved as well. I really liked this film. I think it is the best comic book movie this year. Much better than the wayyyyyy to sooon Spider-Man and The Avengers (which was a good movie, but in a different way). Rankings overall for ll Batman movies by Nolan: 1. The Dark Knight 2. The Dark Knight Rises 3. Batman Begins.
I don't understand the issue with the symbols you have.
The prison sequence was a little sudden, but it is supposed to have no location. It is a place where people do not know of its existence, but they have heard of it. They don't know where it is, but they never want to be there if given the choice. "bane has a line that says I believe, "You feed them hope until their end" or something like that. So the prison and Gotham are one and the same.
I do agree with the twist. I was surprised by it, but I also got caught up in the movie and didn't get hints of the twist in the beginning. They could have done that better.
I liked the fact that they showed that batman is human. When you see him, you feel he is superhuman, but in reality, he is just a really smart guy with lots of money, but he still has the same frailties as everyone else. He falls just like everyone, but he learns to pick himself back up.
The Batwing I thought was cool. I don't anything about air technology or anything so I just went with the flow on that one.
PLot was a little muddled, but I think it all came together nicely. I really could care les if the refugees had grown beards or not. I know they were given supplie throughout their ordeal, maybe they had razors as well?
And with the ending, what did you want to happen?
I respect your opinion and the points you bring up are good points. There are areas I wish could have been improved as well. I really liked this film. I think it is the best comic book movie this year. Much better than the wayyyyyy to sooon Spider-Man and The Avengers (which was a good movie, but in a different way). Rankings overall for ll Batman movies by Nolan: 1. The Dark Knight 2. The Dark Knight Rises 3. Batman Begins.
I thought the movie was great, too bad they're allegedly discontinuing the series.
If I'm picking it apart for flaws like all the " should of been better" crowd needs to do. I'd complain about Bains voice being too muddled at times, and the Occupy Wall Street theme behind Bain.
The ending I thought was pretty good. Obviously it wasn't as good as the last one, but in the group of super heroe movies it was better than everything but the Iron Man movies and Avengers.
If I'm picking it apart for flaws like all the " should of been better" crowd needs to do. I'd complain about Bains voice being too muddled at times, and the Occupy Wall Street theme behind Bain.
The ending I thought was pretty good. Obviously it wasn't as good as the last one, but in the group of super heroe movies it was better than everything but the Iron Man movies and Avengers.
After a couple days to think over it, my view of the movie is pretty high. I rank it right up there with Begins and above TDK. Personally aside from Ledger's GREAT performance in TDK, that movie was a big step down from Begins, so i have a hard time getting all the "its not as good as Dark Knight" posts.
Want to go see it again sometime.
Want to go see it again sometime.
The scene where Batman and Blake talk about the reason and meaning for a mask I saw it differently. Blake said I am not afraid of these people so I don't need a mask, but Batman explained, its not the fear of what people can do to you, it is what these people can do to people close to you. That is why you wear the mask. Like in Batman Begins where Falcone says, "people around you have so much to lose."
I don't understand the issue with the symbols you have.
The prison sequence was a little sudden, but it is supposed to have no location. It is a place where people do not know of its existence, but they have heard of it. They don't know where it is, but they never want to be there if given the choice. "bane has a line that says I believe, "You feed them hope until their end" or something like that. So the prison and Gotham are one and the same.
I do agree with the twist. I was surprised by it, but I also got caught up in the movie and didn't get hints of the twist in the beginning. They could have done that better.
I liked the fact that they showed that batman is human. When you see him, you feel he is superhuman, but in reality, he is just a really smart guy with lots of money, but he still has the same frailties as everyone else. He falls just like everyone, but he learns to pick himself back up.
The Batwing I thought was cool. I don't anything about air technology or anything so I just went with the flow on that one.
PLot was a little muddled, but I think it all came together nicely. I really could care les if the refugees had grown beards or not. I know they were given supplie throughout their ordeal, maybe they had razors as well?
And with the ending, what did you want to happen?
I respect your opinion and the points you bring up are good points. There are areas I wish could have been improved as well. I really liked this film. I think it is the best comic book movie this year. Much better than the wayyyyyy to sooon Spider-Man and The Avengers (which was a good movie, but in a different way). Rankings overall for ll Batman movies by Nolan: 1. The Dark Knight 2. The Dark Knight Rises 3. Batman Begins.
Exactly. Adding to that, Bruce kept saying that anyone can be Batman. The mask is a symbol of hope for Gotham. The Batman becomes the hero Gotham needed, whether he was wearing the costume or someone else takes over.
Totally agree, my disappointment would be they picked a lame political movement to mirror. Should have built on the gov't corruption Harvey Dent story, not rich v poor. Not a huge deal just felt a little flawed.
I actually wish they would have gone more in depth with the rich vs. poor, but they just seemed to gloss over it. I guess if they tried, the movie would have gone for a lot longer. I did like how the entire city when into utter chaos and everything got flipped upside down when people were given the chance to as Bane says "take back the city". Nolan said he based a lot of the film on "A Tale of To Cities" which deals with the French Revolution. Just wish he went more in depth with it. Maybe he actually did, but had to cut stuff out to make the film shorter in time. Just wish he would have gone more in depth with that, that's my opinion though.
Just got home from it. I did enjoy the movie, but the joker was 10x's better. Anne Hathaway just entered my top 3 ladies that my wife will let me "hang out with" w/o getting in trouble.....her body is rock hard.
So looks like a new robin movie coming soon? The character was weak, but if Dolan does it - probably be ok.
Side note Nolan doing a superman movie might be good.
So looks like a new robin movie coming soon? The character was weak, but if Dolan does it - probably be ok.
Side note Nolan doing a superman movie might be good.
Yeah, I got a bit of French Revolution vibe put of it. The first couple hours kind of plodded along for me but the last 45 minutes made the movie.
I wish all movies were even half as good as Nolan's films. The box office receipts and rankings on the imdb's Top 250 will support the quality of his films. Can't wait to see what he comes up with next.
The last five minutes of this film were incredibly powerful and well-done. We shouldn't over-analyze. Movies like this are the reason I love movies. You leave the theater knowing you just got your money's worth.
The last five minutes of this film were incredibly powerful and well-done. We shouldn't over-analyze. Movies like this are the reason I love movies. You leave the theater knowing you just got your money's worth.
No, but if you closed your eyes you could almost hear Mic after Rocky loses to Clubber. Then Rocky goes back to get his eye of the tiger.
I was half expecting to hear Survivor when Wayne was back in training for the second fight.
I went to see it today. Waited to open this thread until after I had seen it (figured someone will spill something). Anyway, I am really impressed. It was phenomenal. I was kept on the edge of my seat through the whole movie. I might need some time to actually choose, but right now it is my favorite of the 3. TDK was good, and the Joker character was brilliantly done, but this one may end up being my favorite. All characters were well done. Overall, it really tied everything and closed stuff out while opening a door for further expansion. Hopefully they do and Nolan will continue the franchise.
