OT: Making A Murderer on Netflix

[Tre4ISU]

I thought this was interesting


Unless you have been sitting in the courtroom and have had the opportunity to hear all of the evidence, it is really not possible or fair to second guess the jury verdict. Clearly the documentarians here had a point of view and skewed their presentation to support only their point of view. We are getting only that evidence that they want us to see, and that bolsters their belief that SA is not guilty. Folks, this was never intended to be an unbiased, objective presentation, otherwise why not include the finding of DNA evidence on the hood latch, why not include the fact that SA specifically requested Teresa when he booked the appointment, that he called her three times that day -- twice using *67 to hide his identity, why not mention that the bullet found in the garage matched a .22 rifle in SA's house, etc.

I get that and I have said that I would say it's probable he killed her. The problem is the inconsistencies. The same guy who knew enough about crime scene cleanup also left blood in the vehicle (but no finger prints) and kept the key to the vehicle? That's not to mention he parked it on his property when he had everything he needed to get rid of it.

The bullet is a good point but there was no blood, just DNA and the expert that testifies did something she's never done to give the finding she did. Then Colburn gives the plates but supposedly isn't looking at the vehicle. Then COlburn and Lenk are the ones who find the key on the 4th sweep of the house and it's sitting in the open. Then you have someone with their throat slashed, stabbed and shot in a garage but there is zero blood anywhere?

To me, the message to be taken here doesn't have as much to do with if SA is guilty. It's that in at least some form, the police made him the murderer. There is zero doubt in my mind that key was planted and there's zero doubt in my mind that the story Brendan gave that the DA went off of was incredibly false. I hadn't heard about the DNA under the hood. Didn't they say in the documentary there was no other SA DNA on the vehicle?

Him requesting her to come do the work is not evidence he killed her. It may mean he's creepy, but it doesn't mean he killed her. IMO, the DA messed this up giving the story to the media they did for emotional effect. That story did not happen.

 

[Cyclonesince78]

This. And I'll be the first to say that the vast majority of law enforcement are good people honestly trying to do their job. But if you've got reason to think you're potentially involved in a crime, there is very little chance to talking your way out of it and you're very likely hurting yourself.

Even if you're 100% not involved, your instincts will tell you to start talking, but you still need to get an attorney before you say anything. Very likely that nothing you say will help much, but some things you say may hurt. Also do not consent to a search. Exert your rights including the right not to speak. If the disabled kid would have just shut his damn mouth, no way he's in jail, IMO.

 

[Tre4ISU]

Isn't that like constantly only highlighting the negative side of a person and then when they do something good you discount it because "Look at all the bad he has done?" If you teach your kid that *random politician* is a liar and crook and only show the worst of him of course your kid won't believe anything when *random politician* does something meaningful or good. Completely discounting someone because their enemy tries to discredit them is silly. Of course their enemy will try to discredit them.

What did he do that was good? He railroaded a clearly slow 15 year old and made up a story to get support on the case. Then he had to resign because he is a creepy **** who thought he was some sort of catch because he had a $350,000 house.

 

[Mtowncyclone13]

What did he do that was good? He railroaded a clearly slow 15 year old and made up a story to get support on the case. Then he had to resign because he is a creepy **** who thought he was some sort of catch because he had a $350,000 house.

I'm not saying the guy is a good guy but if he's claiming the filmmakers didn't include all the evidence there is a really easy way to fact-check that. Go to the court transcripts and look. And people have looked and it's there. it's not like he made a statement without any proof to back it up. Just because the guy is a sleeze doesn't mean parts of what he says can't be true.

 

[Tre4ISU]

I'm not saying the guy is a good guy but if he's claiming the filmmakers didn't include all the evidence there is a really easy way to fact-check that. Go to the court transcripts and look. And people have looked and it's there. it's not like he made a statement without any proof to back it up. Just because the guy is a sleeze doesn't mean parts of what he says can't be true.

Okay so he said one thing that was right. Forgive me for not letting that equal out all of the blatant lying he did to get his convictions.

 

[Tre4ISU]

I'm not saying the guy is a good guy but if he's claiming the filmmakers didn't include all the evidence there is a really easy way to fact-check that. Go to the court transcripts and look. And people have looked and it's there. it's not like he made a statement without any proof to back it up. Just because the guy is a sleeze doesn't mean parts of what he says can't be true.

And that DNA wasn't found until after they had lead Brendan to say that. Why would you unhook the batteries of a car you are hiding and keep the key? That makes no damn sense.

 

[HFCS]

And that DNA wasn't found until after they had lead Brendan to say that. Why would you unhook the batteries of a car you are hiding and keep the key? That makes no damn sense.

Even if we assume he's stupid. A key of a car of someone you murdered and destroyed their body in your bedroom in plain site seems a lot more like a stupid person planting evidence than a stupid murderer.

 

[Tre4ISU]

Even if we assume he's stupid. A key of a car of someone you murdered and destroyed their body in your bedroom in plain site seems a lot more like a stupid person planting evidence than a stupid murderer.

Especially after said murderer, according to experts, cleaned up the scene better than cleanup experts could have. I do think Avery is stupid.........or a genius because he did it and has this many people "on his side." I say it like that because I think he probably did it but don't think the evidence should have lead to a conviction.

 

[Stewo]

Just finished watching. My thoughts:

Steven is innocent. This was a witch hunt. The police framed Steven. I like Bobby and the other dude that acted as his alibi as the killers. I also wouldn't rule out some combo of the victim's brother, the ex-boyfriend and the roommate. Some bad blood between the ex and the roommate potentially. The brother seemed way too certain that Steven was the killer when even the reporters appeared to be uncertain the entire trial. The prosecuting DA is a worthless piece of human garbage. The was substantially more evidence presented that gives reasonable doubt and should have never been found guilty.

I did see that The Innocence Project (as of Dec 22, 2015) has picked back up with some of the aspects of the case. Lastly, I feel pretty strongly that this documentary will eventually lead to Steven's release.

 

[VikesFan22]

Just finished the documentary a bit ago. I avoided reading this thread because I didn't want to know any details before seeing it all myself. I really enjoyed it and agree that it was a crazy mess from the beginning. As soon as I thought I had something figured out, something else surfaced. I've only read the first page of the thread so far and I'm looking forward to reading the rest tomorrow.

 

[Peter]

The documentary shows that our justice system is a total charade and that verdicts are made through emotional manipulation, rather than facts and evidence. The film itself is guilty of this as they left out a number of details that throw suspicion on Avery.

 

[clonedude]

Especially after said murderer, according to experts, cleaned up the scene better than cleanup experts could have. I do think Avery is stupid.........or a genius because he did it and has this many people "on his side." I say it like that because I think he probably did it but don't think the evidence should have lead to a conviction.

That's the thing... none of what "supposedly" happened according to the police... makes any sense whatsoever.

So Steven and Brendan tied a woman up, slit her throat, and then cleaned up the whole mess so that no blood whatsoever could be found in the room anywhere.... yet they were dumb enough to leave a key laying on the floor?

And why was a bunch of her blood found in the back of her car? There was no reason why her body would have ever been in the back of her car. She was stabbed in the trailer, shot in the garage, and burned in the backyard supposedly, so why would she have ever been in the back of her car?

And why would any murderer be dumb enough to hide the victim's vehicle in their own salvage yard? Especially when he also owned a car smasher too.

Even if Steven isn't very bright, there is no way he's dumb enough to act like this.... and if he was, then he shouldn't have been smart enough to clean up all the evidence in his house and his garage. None of this makes any logical sense.

 

[wxman1]

Just finished and I am on the not guilty side.

The county and especially the sheriff office was in the middle of having him pull their pants down and this was their retaliation. Brothers in arms will almost always back each other up. Wouldn't be the first time some of the good ol boys helped each other out.

My money is on the brother or ex.

It certainly was skewed but showed enough evidence that it was justifiable imo.

 

[CYCLNST8]

Well I feel like a lazy piece of ****. Started watching this afternoon and barely left the couch. What a mind ****. Clearly a botched investigation, but now I won't be able to sleep trying to figure out what actually happened. What's the motive? Who had motive? You have a good chance to win a huge $ettlement, but you can't resist raping and killing someone with your nephew??

 

[ripvdub]

SA must've watched a lot of Dexter to keep his garage and trailer that free of dna.

Sooo many shady things in this show to mention. Craziness.

I think they keep denying appeals so they won't have an even larger settlement later.

 

[ripvdub]

I bet all you GB Packers fans love to know that the Halbach brother works for them. In their IT and video ops.

 

[cymate]

i am in the not guilty camp. really interesting documentary. Avery should have gotten out of town after being released from prison the first time.

 

[TXCyclones]

I think the documentary missed some key things that would have been great: Avery's motive, who were the alternate suspects, etc. I came across this site that touches on this. SIAP

http://mobile.onmilwaukee.com/movies/articles/makingamurdereralternativesuspects.html

 

[TXCyclones]

Isn't that like constantly only highlighting the negative side of a person and then when they do something good you discount it because "Look at all the bad he has done?" If you teach your kid that *random politician* is a liar and crook and only show the worst of him of course your kid won't believe anything when *random politician* does something meaningful or good. Completely discounting someone because their enemy tries to discredit them is silly. Of course their enemy will try to discredit them.

If he'll abusehis authority to get what he wants with women then he's showing a pattern that he'll easily abuse his authority anywhere. Even in the state of Iowa if a police officer has found to have lied about something as simple as his hours written on his time-card then he must voluntarily state that at the start of his questioning in any trial he's called in.

 

[CloneFan4]

As captivating as this documentary is I can't get over the fact that so many people watching forget the fact that an innocent girl was brutally murdered and her corpse mutilated. The attention this is getting, has got to open up some old wounds for the family. Can't imagine what they are going through.