TJ Mutcherson/Angelo Hadley to ISU?!

[tazclone]

How would he "ruin it"? Seriously. If he gets in trouble again, he gets kicked off the team, life goes on, the football team and program moves on, nothing is ruined. I bet your one of the geniuses who thought Iowa had no chance against Missouri because they had two players total suspended for their bowl game.

Even worse....he is on probation and will be until after he graduates. If he gets in trouble again, he will be going to jail on three felony charges. The kid has much more to lose than ISU does.

It is completely possible that at age 18, he didn't understand the ramifications of his actions. When he was in court, those ramifications hit him right upside the head and it is completely possible that he woke up and changed his life around.

 

[isuno1fan]

No point in speculating any of the character issues until we have known commitments.

 

[tazclone]

I like how people are pretending this is the issue. Nobody cares if a senior is sleeping with a freshman. It might be a little skeevy, but nothing that should haunt a guy.

But that isn't the issue.

The issue is that he robbed the house of 17k, then used a gun that was stolen in that robbery to commit armed robbery.

Yes, if you stop reading at the "he slept with a 14 year old", I agree, it isn't an issue. But that's only if you stop reading at that point.

I don't care if some kid gets caught smoking pot, or drinking underage, or stuff like that. I care, but believe in second chances, for stuff like what Sim's did. This is far beyond that though.

Not that it matters but it was all the same incident. The way you put it makes it seem like he had sex with the girl, robbed the house and the gun and then took the gun and made another robbery. The reality of it is he slept with the girl while his brother robbed the house. There was a gun so it becomes armed robbery.

 

[tazclone]

I have a feeling that, just maybe, CPR and the rest of his staff (as well as the USF coaching staff) know the kid a little better and no just a bit more about this situation than you. I trust our coaches (and South Florida's coaches) opinions on this kid much more than somebody who just learned his name for the first time this morning.

If CPR wants him, then I want him too.

Bingo until proven otherwise CPR has made some good decisions on guys Although I disagree with the banks decision but that is because I couldn't stand watching him play.

 

[cycloneman003]

no one is really sure what the deal is, but if TJ and Angelo come to ISU, the word is that it's a VERY good chance that ISU gets Grady as well. Grady played with TJ at Freedom high school before he went to Armwood and all 3 played together in leagues before high school and Grady's dad basically set up the TJ and Angelo to USF situation, so the connection is strong there.

 

[Tre4ISU]

do we really have these kids committing or is it still just speculation? and also what is this about it counting vs. last yrs commits? can a school really do that? and do both these kid qualify?

thx

I think they are both early enrollies. If they are we could count them both back to last year as long as we were still below the 25 schoalrship limit. You can do so with up to 4 early enrollies.

 

[Tre4ISU]

He was 17. I was a JUNIOR when I was 17. A junior getting on a freshman isnt a big deal. Pretty sure there are 14 year old sophomores too. How do we know they hadn't been dating since middle school?

Scenario:
Mom and Dad come home to a robbed house.
mom- What the hell happened?
girl- looks like we were robbed.
mom- werent you home?!
girl- yeah.
mom- where were you.
girl- in my room.
mom- with who?
girl- Angelo
mom- was he touching you?!?!?! Call the cops! and make sure they bring a rape kit!

Everyone jumps to conclusions WAY too quickly.

I'm pretty sure he was 18. The article dated the 30th of April says he was arrested twice in that month and he had turned 18 in September. That's my interpretation anyway.

 

[tazclone]

I agree with your statement but where do you draw the line? Also thank you for not attacking me. I really appreciate. Its like talking to a bunch of immature children with all of the personal attacks. Especially when our new recruiting analyst has to do this.

Once someone has paid whatever restitution is required by law for their past indiscretions then that person should be free to pursue being a productive member of society. That includes getting an education and playing football. If ISU gives him that opportunity there will certainly be a risk that he will dissappoint us, but that is true (most likely to a lessor degree) with any player regardless of their past.


If you give someone a second chance and they fail, does that reflect more poorly on the party given a second chance or the person willing to give him that opportunity?

Clonefan4...
This is a good place to draw the line. The kid dated a girl. Used his relationship to rob her parents and got caught. The courts(with the girl's parent's agreement) gave him a penalty that he is serving. It is very possible that at age 18 he did not understand the ramifications of his actions. Nor do we understand the pressure/reasoning for his actions. It is possible that once he was sitting in that court waiting to find out what happened to him that he realized exactly what he did and changed his life. Our coaching staff would understand where he is in life much batter than we would.

One thing we don't know is why he robbed the house? Is he a thug that got his jollies off stealing? Was he a habitual offender? Was he looking for the easy way to some $$$? Was his family in some sort of money crunch? Did his brother pressure him into doing it? Is their gang influences? Those are all things we have absolutely no clue about that would be very pertinent in deciding a kids future.

 

[c.y.c.l.o.n.e.s]

Not that it matters but it was all the same incident. The way you put it makes it seem like he had sex with the girl, robbed the house and the gun and then took the gun and made another robbery. The reality of it is he slept with the girl while his brother robbed the house. There was a gun so it becomes armed robbery.

Almost true - but not quite.

He went back to the girl's house in early April and had sex with her a second time. That is why he got arrested for two counts of lascivious acts and not one. I am assuming that is when the parents found out, which lead to them finding out about the encounter in February, which led to the felony charges against him and his brothers.

Edit: Also, it was grand theft of a firearm... They stole a gun, but didn't use a gun.


SPORTSbyBROOKS » NC Recruit Sexes Up 14-Yr-Old as Brothers Burgle

 

[CloneIce]

Its all good I just thought that someone who was associated with CF should hold to a higher standard. And I grew up in a family where morals, ethics, and honor are held in the highest regard. I guess its not fair for me to force that upon all of you are even force it upon a recruit. For that I apologize, but for everyone saying that I'm judging the kid is dumb. I never said anything against his character. NEVER. I was talking about what he did. I guess I wouldnt be able to give a person a second chance after that situation. I know that reflects badly on my part, but I wouldn't ever forget that.

Some of us were raised to believe in forgiveness and 2nd chances, that it is morally right to give a kid who made a mistake in high school a 2nd chance at life, rather than letting that mistake be the dominant moment in his life.

Just because you believe differently doesn't mean the rest of us posters were not also raised "in a family where morals, ethics, and honor were held in high regard", so please don't imply that you are "forcing" ethics and honor on a bunch of unethical honor-less heathens in this discussion. We just have different views on this subject, we aren't any less or more ethical or honorable than you or your family.

 

[Tre4ISU]

Its all good I just thought that someone who was associated with CF should hold to a higher standard. And I grew up in a family where morals, ethics, and honor are held in the highest regard. I guess its not fair for me to force that upon all of you are even force it upon a recruit. For that I apologize, but for everyone saying that I'm judging the kid is dumb. I never said anything against his character. NEVER. I was talking about what he did. I guess I wouldnt be able to give a person a second chance after that situation. I know that reflects badly on my part, but I wouldn't ever forget that.

I really don't know where you got the idea that I was personally attacking you either. I didn't say you were judging him.

I'm also not saying to forget about it and not worry about it. The leash should be extremely short. Just like with Royce. One slip up and he should be done. He shouldn't have the same leeway someone else might have if he, for instance, got into a fight or something.

I just don't htink you are going to put a 100 kid roster together at ISU that consists of perfect moral cleanliness, that's all.

 

[Tre4ISU]

Some of us were raised to believe in forgiveness and 2nd chances, that it is morally right to give a kid who made a mistake in high school a 2nd chance at life, rather than letting that mistake be the dominant moment in his life.

Just because you believe differently doesn't mean the rest of us posters were not also raised "in a family where morals, ethics, and honor were held in high regard", so please don't imply that you are "forcing" ethics and honor on a bunch of unethical honor-less heathens in this discussion. We just have different views on this subject, we aren't any less or more ethical or honorable than you or your family.

FTR, I am an unethical, honorless heathen. I like the way you put that.

 

[mt85]

Its all good I just thought that someone who was associated with CF should hold to a higher standard. And I grew up in a family where morals, ethics, and honor are held in the highest regard. I guess its not fair for me to force that upon all of you are even force it upon a recruit. For that I apologize, but for everyone saying that I'm judging the kid is dumb. I never said anything against his character. NEVER. I was talking about what he did. I guess I wouldnt be able to give a person a second chance after that situation. I know that reflects badly on my part, but I wouldn't ever forget that.

Forgetting and forgiving can be mutually exclusive.

 

[CloneFan4]

Some of us were raised to believe in forgiveness and 2nd chances, that it is morally right to give a kid who made a mistake in high school a 2nd chance at life, rather than letting that mistake be the dominant moment in his life.

Just because you believe differently doesn't mean the rest of us posters were not also raised "in a family where morals, ethics, and honor were held in high regard", so please don't imply that you are "forcing" ethics and honor on a bunch of unethical honor-less heathens in this discussion. We just have different views on this subject, we aren't any less or more ethical or honorable than you or your family.

I wasnt trying to say that you have less morality than I do. In no way was I trying to say that. I was trying to say that I feel that what he did goes against everything I believe in and that is why I wont welcome him with open arms. I worded that very wrong and once again I apologize.

 

[nickwc]

Come on Wally Burnham.

 

[CloneFan4]

FTR, I am an unethical, honorless heathen. I like the way you put that.

I didnt mean anything like that. I apologize.

 

[tazclone]

Almost true - but not quite.

He went back to the girl's house in early April and had sex with her a second time. That is why he got arrested for two counts of lascivious acts and not one. I am assuming that is when the parents found out, which lead to them finding out about the encounter in February, which led to the felony charges against him and his brothers.

Edit: Also, it was grand theft of a firearm... They stole a gun, but didn't use a gun.


SPORTSbyBROOKS » NC Recruit Sexes Up 14-Yr-Old as Brothers Burgle

I have seen some things that said he was dating the girl. internet rumors of course. Said he was dating her, mom and dad didn't like it then all of this went down and the lascivious acts were thrown in as well.

 

[Frak]

It's not that I'm unhappy because I'm pumped to see us in contention for recruits with this kind of talent. No I don't know that she was in 8th grade but I do know she was 14. Either way there's no way in hell you can say that this is ethically ok for him to do.

I'll disagree there. When you're in HS, it's free game. You see SR/FR hook ups all the time. What ISN'T ethically OK is to have your brothers rob the house while you keep the girl occupied. And then the armed robbery. Still, we don't know what role Hadley played in the whole thing (did he plan or even know about the house robbery? how involved was he with the armed robbery?). Obviously, the judge didn't come down on him too hard since he just got probation.

What matters is that he straightened out and turned himself around at Butler. If CPR judges his character to be OK, I'm all for it. Sure, you'd rather not bring in kids with histories like this, but if we're losing recruits to UCF and commits to KU, obviously ISU needs to take a few risks to get the talent in here necessary to win with.

 

[Judoka]

I'll disagree there. When you're in HS, it's free game. You see SR/FR hook ups all the time. What ISN'T ethically OK is to have your brothers rob the house while you keep the girl occupied.

Exactly, people are preaching to the choir about the girl. Nobody gives a crap about that.

It's the whole stealing of 17k worth of stuff, including a firearm, while he kept her occupied that bothers me.

Second chances are great, and I would have zero issue with this guy enrolling and being a student at Iowa State. However, as a student-athlete he also represents the university in the public eye. If he does sign with us I hope he does keep on the straight and narrow, but I just see the potential downsides being much more than the potention upsides.

 

[ty4cy90]

I'll disagree there. When you're in HS, it's free game. You see SR/FR hook ups all the time. What ISN'T ethically OK is to have your brothers rob the house while you keep the girl occupied. And then the armed robbery. Still, we don't know what role Hadley played in the whole thing (did he plan or even know about the house robbery? how involved was he with the armed robbery?). Obviously, the judge didn't come down on him too hard since he just got probation.

What matters is that he straightened out and turned himself around at Butler. If CPR judges his character to be OK, I'm all for it. Sure, you'd rather not bring in kids with histories like this, but if we're losing recruits to UCF and commits to KU, obviously ISU needs to take a few risks to get the talent in here necessary to win with.

Exactly! Thank you.