***OFFICIAL BIG 12 EXPANSION THREAD 2.0***

[alarson]

Because endowments matter so much to athletics. Its not like anyone is sharing their endowments within conference.

Also, UCF is ranked 173 by USnews rankings for national universities. Okie State 145. USF 161 WVU 168, Texas Tech 156. A good number of UCF's programs are ranked in the top 100. We're not talking a huge dropoff from universities already in the big 12. Besides, why do we pretend this is about anything but athletics anyways. We're not the big 10.

And no, UCF doesnt have a ton of endowment or fanbase built compared to all in the big 10 but they didnt start building their alumni base until the last couple decades (the school itself being less than 50 years old). It will happen with time, and with the fact that they *have* had at least some athletics history and a strong showing in attendance for their level of competition (bringing 35-45k routinely right now, with a 45k capacity stadium) it shows they could transition well to a higher level. When ashford is doing that then yeah, lets talk about them.

 

[drednot57]

When the B1G sucks, I'm first in line saying how much they suck. When Iowa sucks, which has become the new norm, I'm the first in line to say how much they suck. We have a sh*tty coach. We have the worst P5 AD in the nation. Our MBB program is still working its way out of the abyss. (?) Our football team is in a perpetual toilet swirl for the foreseeable future.

It's funny to be called a B1G homer when so many of you guys are never objective, can never say anything positive about the B1G, think the world is conspiring against you. Pretty laughable. Nobody outside of hardcore, conspiracy theorist Big 12 fans think the committee got it wrong.

But I'm the homer. Right.

Um, I think the MBB program has exited the Abyss, and are climbing Mt. Purgatory now. If you think JP is the worst P5 AD in the country, you obviously don't remember BVD (Bruce Van DeVelde) -- you know, the guy who killed the baseball program, and did next to nothing about facilities improvements except continue what was already funded.

 

[cyclonegeek]

I would love to see two more teams added if they could add to our market, but i see the TV market changing and with the big 12 at 10 teams I see we are safer than other conferences. Even with our limited market the Big 12 games still draw good ratings. ESPN is not what it once was and ABC won't support its huge college contracts for long. Now that everyone knows ESPN is an SEC network and that Fox sports 1 is the college sports network things will change.

 

[drednot57]

I would love to see two more teams added if they could add to our market, but i see the TV market changing and with the big 12 at 10 teams I see we are safer than other conferences. Even with our limited market the Big 12 games still draw good ratings. ESPN is not what it once was and Disney won't support its huge college contracts for long. Now that everyone knows ESPN is an SEC network and that Fox sports 1 is the college sports network things will change.

FIFY.

 

[laminak]

Um, I think the MBB program has exited the Abyss, and are climbing Mt. Purgatory now. If you think JP is the worst P5 AD in the country, you obviously don't remember BVD (Bruce Van DeVelde) -- you know, the guy who killed the baseball program, and did next to nothing about facilities improvements except continue what was already funded.

He didn't state JP was the worst. He's referring to Gary Barta. He's an Iowa fan, so all of the "we" and "our" is about the Hawks.

 

[CyFan61]

What I'm scared of is OU or UT will leave the Big 12 and then the entire conference will just dissolve. Then we will be left out in the cold with no place to go. We would have 3 options then: 1. Pray the B1G will take us in 2. Hope that the SEC or PAC want to open up the Midwest TV market (not that we have a very big market share but still...) and offer us a home. 3. We would have to go to a non power 5 conference (technically a power 4 school at that time)

Let's say the Pac-16 thing comes to pass again, for real this time. Texas, Tech, Oklahoma, and OSU head west. The worst case scenario is that West Virginia, Baylor, and TCU are taken in some combination by the ACC and SEC and Kansas perhaps to the Big Ten. (Kansas politics might not allow this without a home for K-State, but this is worst case scenario.)

If that all goes down, Iowa State and Kansas State could do one of two things: (1) Join the American Conference, or choose what I think is the better option, and (2) Retain the Big 12 name for themselves and invite 8-10 schools from the ranks of the mid-majors to join what would then become the best non-major conference. ISU and KSU could poach who they wanted from the American, Mountain West, etc. because the Big 12 name would have value in itself - see the Big East and college basketball as this happened there, too.

Not an ideal outcome but certainly not earth shattering. Of course staying in the top tier is ideal, but for a basketball first school, it could still work (see UConn and Cincinnati having success).

 

[Al_4_State]

If we're going to add schools, do BYU and CSU. Any more, CSU has every bit of market penetration in Denver that CU does, and is a good school academically. They're building a new football stadium that will be Big 12 worthy.

 

[Al_4_State]

Let's say the Pac-16 thing comes to pass again, for real this time. Texas, Tech, Oklahoma, and OSU head west. The worst case scenario is that West Virginia, Baylor, and TCU are taken in some combination by the ACC and SEC and Kansas perhaps to the Big Ten. (Kansas politics might not allow this without a home for K-State, but this is worst case scenario.)

If that all goes down, Iowa State and Kansas State could do one of two things: (1) Join the American Conference, or choose what I think is the better option, and (2) Retain the Big 12 name for themselves and invite 8-10 schools from the ranks of the mid-majors to join what would then become the best non-major conference. ISU and KSU could poach who they wanted from the American, Mountain West, etc. because the Big 12 name would have value in itself - see the Big East and college basketball as this happened there, too.

Not an ideal outcome but certainly not earth shattering. Of course staying in the top tier is ideal, but for a basketball first school, it could still work (see UConn and Cincinnati having success).

If the Big 12 dissolved and KU joined the Big 10, they would still need another team. We'd get that nod before KSU.

FWIW, I don't want that to happen. I like where we're at and think that as long as we can stay in a financially viable league with Texoma schools, we should. Our recruiting would plummet in the Big 10. As bad as it is now, it would be that much worse, I think.

 

[CyFan61]

If the Big 12 dissolved and KU joined the Big 10, they would still need another team. We'd get that nod before KSU.

FWIW, I don't want that to happen. I like where we're at and think that as long as we can stay in a financially viable league with Texoma schools, we should. Our recruiting would plummet in the Big 10. As bad as it is now, it would be that much worse, I think.

If Kansas is part of a B1G expansion, the other part is Virginia or Georgia Tech. If four southern schools went Pac-16, the B1G wouldn't automatically expand--they'd wait until they could poach the ACC. But the remaining Big 12 schools would immediately become free for the taking because all six of them would be searching for a new home. The SEC might think West Virginia is a good option if they could pry away Virginia Tech from the ACC, too. Or they might snag one or both of Baylor and TCU to prevent the ACC from getting into Texas.

The point is that Iowa State is likely not part of a 16-team, 4-conference set-up unless one of those conferences is the Big 12 and the ACC has folded, instead. In that case, Wake Forest might get left out instead (or someone like that).

 

[IAStubborn]

When the B1G sucks, I'm first in line saying how much they suck. When Iowa sucks, which has become the new norm, I'm the first in line to say how much they suck. We have a sh*tty coach. We have the worst P5 AD in the nation. Our MBB program is still working its way out of the abyss. Our football team is in a perpetual toilet swirl for the foreseeable future.

It's funny to be called a B1G homer when so many of you guys are never objective, can never say anything positive about the B1G, think the world is conspiring against you. Pretty laughable. Nobody outside of hardcore, conspiracy theorist Big 12 fans think the committee got it wrong.

But I'm the homer. Right.

My problem is consistancy. If they wanted the 4 best teams "right now" you include OSU, Alabama, Oregon and TCU(you use you freaking rankings and OSU bumps FSU). If you go "most deserving" (aka didn't **** up) you go
FSU,Oregon, Alabama,TCU. It's like they took the top 3 in both. Which is fine but say it's about that and not just the best 4. Everyone says "they had to take FSU" actually no they didnt. I think they got it right with OSU but not with FSU. Politics matter and they did here.

 

[laminak]

The point is that Iowa State is likely not part of a 16-team, 4-conference set-up unless one of those conferences is the Big 12 and the ACC has folded, instead. In that case, Wake Forest might get left out instead (or someone like that).

While I agree with your point, it still really bugs me this can happen. Not because I'm an ISU fan/alum, but because ISU should easily make the cut of 64. If you look at attendance for the sports, athletic performance, academics, enrollment, fan support, etc, ISU should be ranked in the 50's and should make the cut. Yet it might not depending on how the chips fall of being in an unstable conference, "little bro" in a small state, and having a junk football team.

 

[Haverhill]

While I agree with your point, it still really bugs me this can happen. Not because I'm an ISU fan/alum, but because ISU should easily make the cut of 64. If you look at attendance for the sports, athletic performance, academics, enrollment, fan support, etc, ISU should be ranked in the 50's and should make the cut. Yet it might not depending on how the chips fall of being in an unstable conference, "little bro" in a small state, and having a junk football team.

If Iowa State was in the stable conference, and Iowa was in the unstable conference, they'd be in the same situation, simply because the state of Iowa doesn't bring the media revenue.

 

[Haverhill]

If the Big 12 dissolved and KU joined the Big 10, they would still need another team. We'd get that nod before KSU.

FWIW, I don't want that to happen. I like where we're at and think that as long as we can stay in a financially viable league with Texoma schools, we should. Our recruiting would plummet in the Big 10. As bad as it is now, it would be that much worse, I think.

The Big Ten move that scares me is if they take Kansas, Oklahoma, Texas and Virginia. The SEC would then add four more in WVU, VT, NCSU, and maybe one more B12 scrap.

 

[Al_4_State]

The Big Ten move that scares me is if they take Kansas, Oklahoma, Texas and Virginia. The SEC would then add four more in WVU, VT, NCSU, and maybe one more B12 scrap.

I'm pretty comfortable in saying that Texas will never be in the Big 10. Same for OU.

I think we'll be in a Power conference. This idea that schools that are willing and capable of being power conference members getting arbitrarily left out while the Northwesterns, Wake Forests, and Boston Colleges of the world survive is absurd and will not come to pass.

 

[Cydwinder]

The Big Ten move that scares me is if they take Kansas, Oklahoma, Texas and Virginia. The SEC would then add four more in WVU, VT, NCSU, and maybe one more B12 scrap.

If the B1G took all four of those teams, they would be sitting at 18 in the conference. 16 teams seems like the absolute max for conference sizes right now. 18 would basically be like having two conferences that agree to play a championship against each other every year

 

[Al_4_State]

If the B1G took all four of those teams, they would be sitting at 18 in the conference. 16 teams seems like the absolute max for conference sizes right now. 18 would basically be like having two conferences that agree to play a championship against each other every year

That's what 16 would be.

 

[Wesley]

The SEC is ESPN/ABC. The BIG is BTN. The B12 is basically Fox. That is why Fiox should encourage the addition of two more teams for protection of the B12.

 

[Haverhill]

If the B1G took all four of those teams, they would be sitting at 18 in the conference. 16 teams seems like the absolute max for conference sizes right now. 18 would basically be like having two conferences that agree to play a championship against each other every year

The more I think about it, the more I wouldn't mind 18 team leagues... because 18x4 means there would be 72 Power 4 Teams. Iowa State would likely find a home somewhere compared to the 64 Power 4 Team model at 16 team leagues.

 

[Haverhill]

The SEC is ESPN/ABC. The BIG is BTN. The B12 is basically Fox. That is why Fiox should encourage the addition of two more teams for protection of the B12.

The Big Ten and Big 12 still have a pretty good presence on ESPN tho, especially the Big Ten in that 11am slot.

 

[isu81]

I'm pretty comfortable in saying that Texas will never be in the Big 10. Same for OU.

I think we'll be in a Power conference. This idea that schools that are willing and capable of being power conference members getting arbitrarily left out while the Northwesterns, Wake Forests, and Boston Colleges of the world survive is absurd and will not come to pass.

Really a dumb post. As has been specifically covered about 500 times in the first 200+ pages of this post, this has nothing to do with "willing and capable". Northwestern is already IN one of the going-forward and stable conferences. They aren't getting kicked out. We are potentially NOT in one of the stable, going-forward conferences. So we would have to be INVITED to one of the Power 4. With our lack of television market, being one of two major programs in a small state and the lack of any success in football, we would struggle to get that invite. It sure as **** isn't coming from the B10.