Big 12 Conference Realignment

[2speedy1]

Hey man I’m just saying what I feel about the area, downtown Detroit is pretty awesome. White flight is real and the metro area is still 100% dealing with it. Most people that go to Detroit proper are very surprised. Public transit will always suck though

What are you calling White Flight? The highest percentage of people leaving Detroit are black according to data. In 2010 Detroit was 83% Black, in 2020 it was down to 77% Black, Losing 16% of its black residents in that span.

Why isnt this "white flight" affected cities like Minneapolis/St Paul, Des Moines, Omaha, Kansas City etc. I know there was a movement from one neighborhood to the other etc, but we are not talking about poeple moving to the other side of the city, we are talking about more than 1 million people flat out abandoning the city.

Show me another city anywhere in the U.S. that has that kind of decline. White flight or not you dont see NY, Philly, KC, MSP etc declining like that. If it was only about white flight All cities would see the same trend of decline especially those on the East and west coast population centers.

Detroit's issue is not the size of its footprint, its issues is what has caused the people to leave, and make a city whose footprint was for 2 million people now only have 500k.

Of course the footprint is going to be huge for the actual population, it was a city of 3-4 times as many people at one point. When you cut that population by that much it is going to have a lot of empty/abandoned space. The bigger question is why has Detroit when through Decades and decades of decline.

 

[ricochet]

Not even close, Detroit ranks 14th in the US, while SF is 12th and SD is 17th.

Which Metropolitan Areas in the United States Have the Largest Populations?

Here is a listing of the 30 largest metropolitan areas in the United States, with total population, from the Census Bureau.

www.thoughtco.com

He is talking square miles big and the article you reference is number of people big. Cities like New York and San Francisco are geographically pretty small relative to the number of people that live there (i.e. high population density).

 

[1SEIACLONE]

He is talking square miles big and the article you reference is number of people big. Cities like New York and San Francisco are geographically pretty small relative to the number of people that live there (i.e. high population density).

Even then he is wrong.

List of Biggest Cities in the World 2024

Biggest Cities in the World: List of largest cities in the world along with population, land area and density.

www.jagranjosh.com

 

[cayin]

My dream would be to tear down our upper decks and completely redo them - make them significantly more vertical, with multiple levels and a “cover” / awning system like Washington has. Wouldn’t even need to increase capacity.

Oh, and add a legit (non-high school-ass) press box.

the upper decks are not the problem, it is the lower decks. The incline on the upper decks are already pretty steep.

 

[2speedy1]

My dream would be to tear down our upper decks and completely redo them - make them significantly more vertical, with multiple levels and a “cover” / awning system like Washington has. Wouldn’t even need to increase capacity.

Oh, and add a legit (non-high school-ass) press box.

Etc Etc.

Trying to find the "college sized" Press Box/Sky Box in these P4 stadiums.

 

[CysRage]

If that's what you really meant, you could have stopped after your first two words. The rest of your sentence appeared 'tongue in cheek'.

No need to be confused. You're pretty smart. Unless you live in Ames, or support the Big 12, it's hard for you to understand.

This. No fans in the Big Ten or SEC understands how rough it was to go through 2010, 2011, 2021 as an ISU fan (or K-State, Texas Tech, Okie State fans) when it was looking like the Big 12 was folding and the outlook was horrible each time. Somehow the Big 12 survived for various reasons. I would argue the Big 12 is the most stable as it has ever been without Texas, OU, A&M, Nebraska calling all the shots in the conference yet looking at switching conferences at the same time.

Poor Washington State and Oregon State are actually seeing the fears ISU (and other Big 12 teams) had over the last decade.

 

[FriendlySpartan]

Even then he is wrong.

List of Biggest Cities in the World 2024

Biggest Cities in the World: List of largest cities in the world along with population, land area and density.

www.jagranjosh.com

How am I wrong?

 

[ClubCy]

It's like telling your wife her ass looks fat in her outfit.

It's probably true but you dont actually say it.

It's more about having a bit of tact.

It would be similar to them saying "Our players assault women" While true, it’s in really poor taste to say.

It’s nowhere near sexual assault. My god. It’s a t shirt worn during fall camp. Lighten up and have a laugh.

 

[FriendlySpartan]

What are you calling White Flight? The highest percentage of people leaving Detroit are black according to data. In 2010 Detroit was 83% Black, in 2020 it was down to 77% Black, Losing 16% of its black residents in that span.

Why isnt this "white flight" affected cities like Minneapolis/St Paul, Des Moines, Omaha, Kansas City etc. I know there was a movement from one neighborhood to the other etc, but we are not talking about poeple moving to the other side of the city, we are talking about more than 1 million people flat out abandoning the city.

Show me another city anywhere in the U.S. that has that kind of decline. White flight or not you dont see NY, Philly, KC, MSP etc declining like that. If it was only about white flight All cities would see the same trend of decline especially those on the East and west coast population centers.

Detroit's issue is not the size of its footprint, its issues is what has caused the people to leave, and make a city whose footprint was for 2 million people now only have 500k.

Of course the footprint is going to be huge for the actual population, it was a city of 3-4 times as many people at one point. When you cut that population by that much it is going to have a lot of empty/abandoned space. The bigger question is why has Detroit when through Decades and decades of decline.

1. Google Detroit white flight, just because it doesn’t happen in your time frame doesn’t mean it isn’t white flight. Detroit actually lead the country in this regard.

2. Detroit is no longer in decline it has actually gained population the last two years.

3. Yeah I’d to take a population of 2mil and decrease that to 600-700k a lot of services are going to suffer. It’s to much area to cover for EMS and fire. I worked during my residency downtown, I’m very familiar. The old adage use to be that you called jimmy John’s before 911 because they get there faster.

4. Again I’m not holding Detroit up to be this amazing American city like Seattle or NY, but your view is from someone that hasn’t been in a really long time

 

[exCyDing]

This. No fans in the Big Ten or SEC understands how rough it was to go through 2010, 2011, 2021 as an ISU fan (or K-State, Texas Tech, Okie State fans) when it was looking like the Big 12 was folding and the outlook was horrible each time. Somehow the Big 12 survived for various reasons. I would argue the Big 12 is the most stable as it has ever been without Texas, OU, A&M, Nebraska calling all the shots in the conference yet looking at switching conferences at the same time.

Poor Washington State and Oregon State are actually seeing the fears ISU (and other Big 12 teams) had over the last decade.

Considering how quickly the PAC fell apart once things started, it’s a minor miracle the B12 survived through multiple rounds of raids and defections.

I agree the B12 is more stable now than at any point in its history. I’m not really worried about any of the corner schools trying to cause problems or throw their weight around simply because any threat to leave is empty. If they got a B10/SEC invite, there’s no way to keep them. As long as they don’t, the only comparable option is the ACC, but who knows what happens when their GOR is broken or expires.

 

[SolarGarlic]

You are right, this should be a model city. No most cities are not like this.



Tell me another city that has lost 70% of its population. Tell me a city that in the last century went from close to 2 mil population to now approaching only 500k.

This is not about the size of the city.

I challenge you to find a single neighborhood in Des Moines that looks like this, as far out of downtown you want to go.

As a matter of fact most cities the outskirts are exploding, DM suburbs are some of the fastest growing in the country. So you cant say its because these areas are outside downtown as a reason for them being abandoned.

Detroit is a dump, outside a block or two downtown, maybe.

Sheesh, you really hate Detroit lol

 

[KnappShack]

Sheesh, you really hate Detroit lol

This level of city hate should be reserved for St. Louis

 

[1SEIACLONE]

Y

How am I wrong?

You stated the Detroit could hold the square milage of SF, SD and Manhattan combined, and its roughly the same size a little bigger than SF.

 

[2speedy1]

It’s nowhere near sexual assault. My god. It’s a t shirt worn during fall camp. Lighten up and have a laugh.

You are missing the point.

I didnt compare it to sexual assault, I compared the lack of tact.

I notice you didnt think saying your wife had a fat ass was a problem.

 

[2speedy1]

Sheesh, you really hate Detroit lol

I dont hate it.

Its just a run down dump. I am calling it what it is.

Our Spartan is the one that is saying it is Nice... somehow.

I will say the sketchiest Gas Station and bathroom I have ever been in was in Detroit. Like I have never been in any place even close to as sketchy.

 

[Clonefan94]

View attachment 132192 View attachment 132193

View attachment 132195 View attachment 132196

View attachment 132197 View attachment 132198

View attachment 132199 View attachment 132200


Etc Etc.

Trying to find the "college sized" Press Box/Sky Box in these P4 stadiums.

Right, who gives a **** about the press box? It adds zero income at a huge cost. If the press wants a better box we’ll gladly accept the donation from said press to build it. I’ve never understood the infatuation with press boxes.

 

[Amac12]

Sheesh, you really hate Detroit lol

I travel to Detroit often for work and the transformation over the last few years is pretty impressive. The downtown with the pro sport facilities and casino is very nice and have always felt safe in that area. Also, I would put some of Detroit's suburbs up against any in the country. Lots of really bad areas but seems to be a major effort to clean up the blighted areas. The auto jobs are never going to be what they were 30-40 years ago.

 

[2speedy1]

1. Google Detroit white flight, just because it doesn’t happen in your time frame doesn’t mean it isn’t white flight. Detroit actually lead the country in this regard.

2. Detroit is no longer in decline it has actually gained population the last two years.

3. Yeah I’d to take a population of 2mil and decrease that to 600-700k a lot of services are going to suffer. It’s to much area to cover for EMS and fire. I worked during my residency downtown, I’m very familiar. The old adage use to be that you called jimmy John’s before 911 because they get there faster.

4. Again I’m not holding Detroit up to be this amazing American city like Seattle or NY, but your view is from someone that hasn’t been in a really long time

You are saying a city that has consistently lost population for 70 years at a rate of something like 200K+ per decade is somehow doing good now because it has seen a couple years of not losing population.

My point has been that there is no other city that I know of that has seen that kind of decline, none.

And the reason it is so bad is because of that decline. The reason there is so much abandoned space is because of this decline. The struggle to maintain these areas and services is because of this decline.

The reason for this decline for 70+ years is not strictly "White Flight". It may be a factor, and may have been a larger factor in some of those decades but not the entire issue. It is not the issue for the last several decades, at least not the main one, as for the last decade+ more Black people have left than White.

You have been saying the problem is the city has too much land for the population, well of course it does, but that is not the reason those spaces are abandoned, those spaces were abandoned causing the extra space. You cant go from 2m to 500K and not have a ton of abandoned space.

But again, give me one city that has seen the kind of decline over the last century that Detroit has. Give me 1 city that has as much abandoned property as Detroit. Again that abandoned property is because of the decline, not what caused the decline.

I get what you are saying it has a decent downtown, but outside of those few blocks it is a cesspool.

St Louis is a dump too, but it has some nicer parts, too, but overall its not good, but you will not find anything close to the amount of abandoned property there (or really anywhere) as you do in Detroit. But as you say Detroit has possibly leveled off, well I hope so, if it doesnt soon it will be a ghost town, losing 200K per decade is not sustainable and would almost certainly have to level off at some point.

Since 2019:

 

[CysRage]

Right, who gives a **** about the press box? It adds zero income at a huge cost. If the press wants a better box we’ll gladly accept the donation from said press to build it. I’ve never understood the infatuation with press boxes.

Someone should really make a post that can be shared every time someone complains JTS press box is "too small". I'll start it..

1) JTS press box appears smaller since a majority of club seats and suites in JTS are in between concourses. Other stadiums with "bigger" press boxes have these built into the press box.
2) JP has said multiple times JTS press box is more than adequate for Press and TV. Believe me, if our press box was inadequate, you'd be hearing Randy Peterson and Travis Hines openly complain about it. Both of them have no problem airing their other grievances against ISU athletics.
3) When has a recruit ever said they picked a school based on the size of their press box? I rest my case.

 

[FriendlySpartan]

Y

You stated the Detroit could hold the square milage of SF, SD and Manhattan combined, and its roughly the same size a little bigger than SF.

Yep it was SF, manhattan and Boston not San Diego. Detroit is way bigger then SF